BOTC - US Lacrosse Community Forum Forums NORTHEAST LACROSSE BOTC MAIN FORUM (LI, CT, WC) Conflicts! When HS Coaches Incorporate Summer Tournament Teams in Town

Clearly a conflict of interest for the HS Coach to run a for profit summer program. More of a conflict when the program is only open to kids from the coaches HS. The problem is also compounded when influential parents are involved with the program. Not a good situation.

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I miss the days when a lacrosse coach also coaches football and wrestling and didn't think about lacrosse until March 1, then on June 1, he would put his stick away while he gets ready for his life guard gig in the summer. The old school coach never got involved in our personal lives by asking "where are you going to college"?" and any way I can help"?. The good old days when you had HS lacrosse coaches for 3 months a year and none of his "extra" coaching B.S. like summer leagues, camps and youth programs. Coaches today suck!!!

Coercion ( /koʊˈɜrʃən/) is the practice of forcing another party to behave in an involuntary manner (whether through action or inaction) by use of threats or intimidation or some other form of pressure or force. In law, coercion is codified as the duress crime. Such actions are used as leverage, to force the victim to act in the desired way. Coercion may involve the actual infliction of physical pain/injury or psychological harm in order to enhance the credibility of a threat. The threat of further harm may lead to the cooperation or obedience of the person being coerced

Last I read this is a felony and punishable by imprisonment maybe the AD should get involved or school board.

You can not have an rational discussion regarding this subject with anyone who will not admit that there is a conflict of interest. They know that it is wrong yet they refuse to admit it. They can not have an honest debate.

sounds like you are saying you can not have a rational discussion with someone who does not agree with you.

You can't have a rational discussion with an ideologue.

I can see how it can be a conflict of interest or better yet perceived as a conflict of interest.

Here is my stance as a parent in the middle. Anyone who coaches my son should get paid. HS and Travel coaches do not get paid very much. I have no problem with a skilled coach trying to gain $$. If he is good the kids will want to play and the parents will want to pay.

My town school coaches do not interfere with the youth programs. I wish they did; they have been invited. Our town has a great core of boys in the odd Grad years and can be augmented with a handful of amazing players in the even grad years. My town also has dedicated and knowledgeable dads to help (that is at times also a problem - the reason the school coaches were asked to help). But the town school coaches keep a distance till HS.


How I see this as an issue is when the town does not have a good group to work with. When that happens the better players do not want to stay in town and the parents (doing as they should as parents) try to put their child in the best position possible so their child does not play down to the town level. (might be to harsh of a statement but you understand)

In this case, I believe the best way for the player to get better (and not get surpassed once puberty happens) is to train, play and work harder with players of or above their ability. In particularly with a vast array of players OUTSIDE OF THE TOWN.

Now I will say I wish my school coaches got involved, but I also think there is plenty of time/room/weekend to fit both travel and school in but I am sure there will be some who say be careful what you wish for.

In the last few years there has been a disturbing trend as HS coaches try and cash in on the for profit (or questionable non for profit) summer tournament teams. It started when some business minded coaches started open tryout teams, now the trend is HS coaches charging big fee's for summer teams that draw exclusively from there own school districts. How do public schools allow this type of quid pro quo to occur? Its one thing when you pay for a summer program and also pay to attend a private school which shares the same coach. Now it seems you have to pay the head coach of the public school boys/ girls teams to get on the field. The Conflicts of interest seem to run so deep yet it continues. Which program is the coach incentified to develop? The School district program or the one that pays him cash on top of their salary? How do they not play undeserving kids that have been paying them every summer? Are kids punished if they play for a competing club? This seams to be a hot topic issue in the towns these teams exist, i am interested to hear others experiences.

Above is the original post.

I did not go and read all of posts so can someone please explain how it is not a conflict of interest for a HS Coach to run a for-profit team that has only players from the school that he or she coaches at?

It is not a conflict of interest if kids have the option to play on the team or play on a private summer team or not play lacrosse over the summer without ramifications and in the spring the coach plays the best 10 players in the spring.

It is a perceived conflict of interest if kids/parents are afraid to not play for fear of losing playing time or not getting moved up ect. in the spring

It is a conflict of interest when it is made clear that if you do not play for the HS coaches for profit summer team you will lose playing time or other benefits that you would have gotten if you had played.

IMHO - I would rather live in a town with a high school coach that is dedicated to the program, involved in the youth programs and the summer team, makes a little money on the summer team rather then the guys that show up on March 1st.

I do not think that there is any correlation between success in the spring and where the kids play in the summer.

Massapequa and Smithtown East kids play for various clubs. Traditionally Garden City and Manhasset kids have played Club Ball in the summer. Syosset kids play Club and Town. West Islip kids play for West Islip. Ward Melville kids have done both.

I think the broader the experience the better. Playing with different players and playing for different coaches can help a player in their development. There can be no question that playing on one of the “Top” Club Teams has certain benefits.
Access to the top recruiting showcases, participation in the most competitive tournaments, excellent coaching, playing with the strongest players and an additional advocate for your son are all positive. These benefits are most important for the rising 9th and 10th graders and maybe the rising 11th graders as well.

If the HS Coach turns a profit off the “Town Club Team” and there is the slightest hint that there will be repercussions if you do not play for that team then there is a conflict of interest. If playing for a club team is held against a player there is a problem. They say that perception is reality so if the perception is that you have to play for the Town Team “or else” there is a problem.

In the end, I think there is a conflict of interest especially if the HS is involved at the younger grades.

Of course you will never get an admission from the HS coach if your club playing kid suddenly gets cut or rides the bench. None are stupid enough to tell you "it is because you didn't play for my summer program." There are 100 reasons the coach can come up with to justify his actions and how do you prove it was because your son opted out of the coach's summer for-profit program? Good luck with that one......and therein lies a major conflict. This is a fairly new development so time will tell how much is perception and paranoia vs. actual reality. If outside club kids continue to get major roles on the varsity and are not penalized in any way then perhaps it is a win-win for everyone. Not sure yet though.

Once PAL is over and the kids are going into HS if they choose to attend a private school why would you expect to be involved with the HS program?

Once PAL is over and the kids are going into HS if they choose to attend a private school why would you expect to be involved with the HS program?

If the summer program is not affiliated with the high school (except for it being a town program and run by HS coaches why can't a kid from that town still play even if they are going to private schhol??

Town PAL programs are the feeder systems for Town HS Varsity. In my town the offseason training, winter & summer leagues are run by the Varsity Booster Club. If your kid chooses to go to Private School and is not going to be playing for the local school they are not invited to participate.

It's a town program, to say a kid can't play since he's not going to town HS is wrong. He lives in the town should be aloud to play.

Once youth league finishes and the HS coach starts overseeing off season training why would they invite a kid that is not part of their program. Once you decide to leave you can't come back !

Again, it's a program that can't be affiliated with the school district, so anyone should be allowed to play. If HS coaches are in charge then it's a conflict of interest.

Once youth league finishes and the HS coach starts overseeing off season training why would they invite a kid that is not part of their program. Once you decide to leave you can't come back !

If the practices are on school grounds then as a tax paying member of the district he has a right to be there

Once youth league finishes and the HS coach starts overseeing off season training why would they invite a kid that is not part of their program. Once you decide to leave you can't come back !

Which high school has the worst Administration? Worst Athletic Director?

Think about the concerns that you have. Where do the issues lie?

[quote=Anonymous][quote=Anonymous]
If the practices are on school grounds then as a tax paying member of the district he has a right to be there

If you put a coach in a position that he has to take a kid on tHat kid is going to collect dust on the sidelines. In our district we did take on kids who wanted to play that went to a private school but we were always hurting for numbers. In a case like ESM they don't need you and shouldn't have to take you. The summer is something that coach does for no pay as a service to his kids and it's a good thing as they are trying to get the kids some looks from schools. I say as long as the coach isn't making a huge profit and he is giving everyone a decent amount of playing time it's all good

Are coaches allowed to ask for money for school fall ball and claim it's for gas money and time away from their families? Wondering if this is school policy?

Who is going to stop them?