BOTC - US Lacrosse Community Forum Forums NORTHEAST LACROSSE BOTC MAIN FORUM (LI, CT, WC) Long Island Lacrosse League : Overdue or Just Right?

On the soccer front, Long Island is a fairly organized structure with the Long Island Junior Soccer League at the center of club/team/player activies and a range of higher leagues that are available through LOL's parent structure. Some would complain that the LOL is too restrictive in regulating teams and players resulting in a less-than-friendly player environment.

The Long Island Lacrosse scene however is less organized at the league level yielding more scheduling power to the individual clubs and thereby increasing their control over the players at a club level. Could Long Island benefit from an organized lacrosse league that covers both Nassau and Suffolk?

Does the lack of a central league in lacrosse lead to more duplication of effort which in turns represents higher costs to the players and their families?

What are your thoughts on the Long Island LAX league scene? BOTC welcomes your views.

The Long Island Lacrosse League runs a summer league between early July and end August for both boys and girls age groups (third grade to junior varsity). Generally the games are two 25 minute periods. Four age groups - 3rd/4th grade, 5th/6th grade, 7th/8th grade, and JV. There has to be a way to bring a Fall league to Long Island to avoid the tournament costs.

I wasn't aware of a summer league for lacrosse. My daughter playes in the spring and I thought that ended after 6th grade.. I'd much prefer a summer league as opposed to one of the "elite" clubs. Where can I get more info.?

My daughter did this for one summer and it was great. You have to have a team coach as well as players who are willing to do make this commitment. In all the years my daughter played with the town PAL team, only 1 coach told us about this and wanted to do it. I think they also run an indoor winter league. Your daughter can join as an independent player if her town team doesn't play. I think you might also be able to do this with the summer league. I think this site is great, because I really had to ask around to find this information out.

I really don't see the need to have a Long Island Lacrosse league with PAL doing what I feel is a pretty good job for spring Lacrosse. PAL includes both Nassau and Sufoul counties and I have found the refing to be good overall.

BOTC Industries research has led us to the Long Island Lacrosse League web site. There you will find details about boys/girls leagues, particularly during the summer months, for a variety of age groups. BOTC Industries also noted a boys league in the Fall season although the number of age groups is smaller.

Long Island Lacrosse League Website

Asking questions is key and there is a Q&A on the website that seems to cover many of the basics.

Lacrosse League Questions and Answers

Part of the mission of BOTC is to bring some light to the somewhat cloudy and club based lacrosse market for the benefit of our readers. We are hoping that some of the Long Island organizations reach out to us here on BOTC to share information with the Long Island LAX community.

To answer the question "Where do I go to get more information?", the answer is simple : come to Back of the Cage and we will establish this site as the portal for all answers related to lacrosse!

Do the lax clubs that are mentioned on this board actually play each other here on LI? Do the Yellow Jackets ever play a league or scrimmage game against the Express for example?

The clubs that are mentioned in this forum and many others play each other in Tournaments. These teams are basically tournament teams whose players come together from other town and school teams to play in summer tournaments

The youth of Long Island would benefit if there was a single organization administering all the leagues and tournaments. PAL tries to do this in the Spring but there are a multitude of other leagues, tournaments and travel clubs all vying for lacrosse dollars being spent in what is now a year round sport.

With all these separate entities managing the experience for the kids we see rules change, competition change and the quality of officiating can vary greatly.

Let them create 3 divisions for all age groups –developmental (1-2 years experience), competitive((3+ years) and Elite (3+ years) and promote it that way. Kids want to play so find a way to match kids of similar talent against one another. Make all kids get US Lacrosse # when they begin the sport, require all towns/travel teams register with US Lacrosse. Their numbers are required on all subsequent registrations for any youth lacrosse tournament, camp, league etc. That would give the organizers the ability to ensure kids of similar talent are matched.

You’d see competitive lacrosse on all levels. You would no longer see “travel team “X” playing in a novice/developmental town league tournament masquerading as a team from Town Y throttling kids with their matching helmets and sticks so they can feel success because when this very same travel team enters tournaments with Elite competition, the outcome is usually different.

People would understand what to expect when registering, things could be easily promoted and most importantly, a single entity could manage and promote all of these opportunities to families. The kids benefit, the organizers benefit, the facility owners and operators benefit. Just something to consider.

Isn't it about time that a true all-Long Island Lacrosse League get established rather than these small town leagues that cannot handle top level elite clubs? Seriously, the best group that has come forward to establish this type of league is Back of the Cage! No team involvement, but a good organization to build on ... what do you think CageSage? Interested in having BOTC run a cross-Long Island league?

Excellent post. Well thought out concept. Let's do it. It would be great. Let parents and children who are all about scholarships play on the YJ's and offer this opportunity to the masses.

is there a fall team for juniors ?

That is a great idea. It should be run as similar to [lacrosse] as possible, with divisions based on skill level, and their own picture ID cards, with DOB, renewed each year, with birth certificates required, to get the card (vs. US Lax card, which you can get any age you want, no picture ID, you can use someone else's, etc). The ref can check the kids in before each game, like soccer. Only takes a few mins, including any rules clarifications, before each game.

If we are talking about a summer club league, it sounds like a great idea. In my experience, the PAL spring league does a pretty good job of providing opportunities for town teams. However, it would be a huge bonus to have a summer weeknight league (with playoffs) for the club teams. Maybe then we could stop driving so far away to play teams from our own backyards!

U based, keep an up to date website, have standings and a playoff, and answer emails. Do all that for a reasonable cost and you'll be all set. I would rather play less tournaments and play 2 or 3 games a week in a league. Too many tournaments. I would prefer the league and play in select tournaments. Get enough teams and you may attract a corporate sponsor. In the end, if it is well organized the league will be successful.

Who will be running the league and where will the games be played?

The games will be played on Long Island and the person heading up the "sanctioned" league will be sending out invites to clubs to explain what he plans and to get input from everyone...nothing set in stone I'm told. The meeting is expected to take place at a hotel on Island in September...we'll let you know what's happening as we get the info.

Awesome, and long overdue!

age groups for this league?

It already exists. There's a fall league run by the same guys who do the greenport shoot out. They play at farmingdale and also have a summer league and indoor winter. The website is already listed in this thread. The leagues and that tournament are some of the most economical that you can find. Problem with getting the bigger clubs to play in it is THEY AREN'T REAPING THE BENEFITS. That's why we now have a oyster bay fall league for probably twice the cost. Don't forget the rock star winter league which was complained about constantly on here.

As long as it's not Pappas or Channy running it.

Thought we were talking about one all encompassing league, like L.I. Junior Soccer

It is not a lacrosse guy that will head up this league. he has no dog in the hunt, which is why it should be excellent...Like BOTC he will have no affiliation with any club, nor will he run tournaments. He will just administer a league along with his advisory board, which will be made up of the member clubs who will vote for the board members.

My bet is gary grossman, he is making a fortune with his soccer model and lacrosse parents spend way more money and are even crazier than soccer parents. Lacrosse tournaments can be up to 3 times more expensive than soccer and club teams can be 6 times or more than travel soccer teams. It will be like printing money!!

Is this a League by Jake .... Li jake steinberg lacrosse

He should have a parent advisory board as well. Just to solicit feedback. This league can really be something special if done right. Less tournaments and more meaningful games.

When can you share more information about the league or when can the owner actually put some real information on their website?

I think it will be September...

Trying to understand- is this in addition to PAL run league and club run tournaments? Or- is the goal for them to all be on board together? Or- is this for a different option for our kids- rather than playing club they can join this league? Just trying to understand the possible goals of the league. Also wondering- is this like the various leagues I read about in the Maryland forum? Thanks.

It will mean the end of PAL

Sounds like botc is getting into the lax business....

I have told you all that I know, perhaps with the exception that is already sanctioned, which means that every player will be insured and the fields that the games are played on will be able to offer a Certificate of Liability Insurance in the amount of at least 1 million dollars.

When I find out more I will share it with everyone.

Same web hosts

www.[lacrosse].com is NOT the league's website....the league's website has not been built yet.

Ok.. And not Jake Steinberg.. Body by Jake?

Isn't this for Club teams? Town teams will still play in PAL, correct?

I can't see TG playing YJ playing 91 playing Liberty etc Some think they are better than others and won't share a field with these other clubs on a weekly basis.

PREMISE: This is a transparent league that offers divisions that are recreational (PAL-like), divisions that are more competitive, divisions with travel teams, and run by an independent.

My thoughts: It would be awesome….but it must unite the entire LI lax community and it must benefit everyone involved.

If it’s only a league for travel/elite teams, it fails to serve the LI community.

I wish this attempt occurred earlier...at least for the age groups of my children.

Now, if you are the individual who is starting this new league, please take the following scenario under consideration, as I think it pertains to many towns here on the island:

A few of our local cronies who helped ‘run the show’ have split up this community, and now almost all families are forced to look elsewhere. Some great players/families want no part of travel lax. They wish for better options. Other families felt forced to join travel lax and are now regrettably pulled into the expensive travel lax machine. They wish for better options. Other families love travel lax but do not like the recreational scenario—because the town organization won’t make A/B teams, or make it very difficult to create a select tournament team, because the cronies want to control everything. Those families wish for better options.

Unfortunately, our kids, who just want to play together with talented friends in their age group/grade, may only play together in the MS or HS seasons only. Now there's tension from the different family factions on the sidelines looking for where they fit in an imaginary pecking order, all while the kids suffer throughout the process. It’s just wrong.

With tryouts 2-3 weeks away for travel, more families from all over LI are getting sucked into the vortex, and another nail is in the coffin for those who truly wish their community could develop together, cost effectively, in a league that benefits everyone of all levels.

I truly wish this league success BUT hope it benefits everyone in future generations. I really do.

Next year is definitely too late to mend the mess here. It will take 4-5 years to to correct itself, BUT ONLY IF the new lax kindergarten families can be educated. It sucks for those of us in it. Chances are the cronies will pass the power down to younger cronies, and so on…But if the process of a new league takes 4-5 years in order to clean up the old mess, and it's a league that can benefit everyone, fantastic. It’s worth it.

Who knows, maybe it will help those towns that can't decide on A/B teams...the town organization can now have a competitive offering with tryouts, and a recreational offering (PAL). But that may open a can of worms with any by-laws of PAL:…

...Any game not on the official schedule or any game played with a NON-P.A.L. Youth Lacrosse League will be considered a NON-SANCTIONED game. The team and or community playing a non- sanctioned game will assume all responsibility and liability for its players, coaches, spectators and officials...
...NO P.A.L. Lacrosse COACH will be permitted to coach in the P.A.L. spring youth lacrosse league if he or she is coaching in any other youth lacrosse league playing with NON-SANCTIONED N.Y. State or P.A.L. RULES DURING the spring. If so, the coach in question would have to sign a disclaimer. A Team participating in another league can not enter that team in the P.A.L. as a full team. That team must be broken up. This has always been a rule of the P.A.L….

In conclusion, if the organization for ‘Your Town' PAL sticks with PAL and not this new league, communities will be broken more, because some parents or hotbeds will create a new organization to play in this new sanctioned league…great, just what we need…two sets of cronies….if you think the back stabbing and nastiness was too much already, think about the fighting over field space in the town now!

THIS LEAGUE MUST UNITE EVERYONE, OR IT WILL CREATE A RIFT MUCH LARGER THAN THE ONE THAT CURRENTLY EXISTS.

Sanctioned by Who? US Lacrosse?