BOTC - US Lacrosse Community Forum Forums NORTHEAST LACROSSE BOTC MAIN FORUM (LI, CT, WC) Boys 2023-10th Grade Fall 2020/Summer 2021

It's a rigged game for families that can afford to have their kids repeat grades - with all the hype, am happy to see Ty Xanders finally beginning disclose age info. If these are high profile student athletes - how's that academic arrested development working?

There is actually nothing wrong with holdbacks. If someone wants to be 18 and a sophomore in HS, fine. But youth lacrosse should be organized by birth year, Hockey is a great example of how this can work. There, unless a kid is a Jack Eichel type phenom, the college coaches don't want him at 18 when he leaves HS. The large majority of freshman playing D1 hockey are 19-20 yo. For on age kids, the kids will play a year or two in juniors (or a top level 18U team) until they are ready.

Thus, club lacrosse should be age based through age 15. Starting at 16, there should be a junior system where the top 16-20 year olds not yet in college play - this should be a closed invite only league with only elite players. For every one else - it will continue age based through 18.

If he's a 2021 he would be starting his Senior year.

The double holdback is actually the #1 2021 kid. That kid should be starting his sophomore year in college. Instead he is a rising senior. Again, coaches don’t care. I was at 3d Blue Chip event years ago when several droned on about how they love holdbacks since they are bigger, stronger and more mature. I agree 100% that lax should be age based.

Lol. He’s got nothing on Millon. 2023 and turning 18 in the spring. And yes he’ll be 20 when he graduates high school.

That's some good information, wonder if that double holdback status will be taken into account in recruiting reports and college coach's evals.

No it wont and why should it. A college coach generally has an athlete for 4 or 5 years and if you can get an athlete with 2 years additional years of maturation and strength that is who they will pick. The Hockey analogy a few posts ago nailed it on the head. Unlike professional sports where a coach or team can spend a couple of years waiting for the athlete to mature or grow, a college coach doesn't have that option. A coach wanting bigger and faster makes perfect sense and it won't change. Signed, Public school parent whose son turns 18 in May of senior year.

Harvard just committed a 2022 rising junior goalie. The kid has a 2002 birthday which means he should be starting his freshman year in college. Let that sink in for people who think coaches care about birthdays or that there isn’t a huge upside to holding back your kid. Sad but undeniably true: CHEATING WORKS!

On the Harvard commit, chirps from the opposing attack during his senior year "hey can you buy us some beer after the game?" or "Is this 15th year of school going too fast for you?" or just segue into Good Will Hunting quips "Your folks just spent 150 grand on HS education you could have gotten for $1.50 in late fees at the public library"

He
Hes not really going to be 18 in spring ? right? I'd believe 17 if he was a double hold back.

It will be taken into account when he is 30 years old going to his 1st job interview after he realized there is no money in lacrosse. So your 30 years old and spent 6 years in high school and 5 in college..... Great candidate to clean toilets.

Why does anyone think this kid or any of the other reclassed kids are looking at a lacrosse career. If anyone looks at the 2022 list of committed schools I would say its well worth it. Some of the schools include Duke, Virginia, Princeton, Cornell, Yale, Notre Dame, Harvard, etc . . .While it is true that not all the schools are for boys who reclassed the point is that reclass or not the top boys are going to excellent academic institutions and if they graduate from these schools and work hard then they are good to go. Also, I am sure a few will seek the "pro" route (and hopefully one day a lifestyle can be made for others not named Rabil and Parnell) it would seem that playing lax is working so far.

Your exactly right. They love doing 8th grade math and english so much their parents are going to fork over the 10k private school tuition again and again. Lets spend $20k in EXTRA private school tuition to go on top of the already 40k so our son can get 20-30k in lacrosse scholarships. Surely nobody is that dense so they must be holding back for the love of math, english, science etc.

I commend the parents that notice their kids have "LEARNING DISABILITIES" and step up to give their kids the help they need...Maybe they got the extra help, and did their homework, maybe their school district couldn't connect or didn't care. But to say give up on the sport, is wrong. Physical ability is just has important has mental.

Your talking about lacrosse in his forum,not football or basketball. If your kid is 6ft 9 or taller then physical may be just as important. If your kid can't pass grade 8 then cut out the lacrosse until schooling gets on track. Your not going to make a financial career out of lacrosse. Unless you want to keep paying your kids rent for the rest of his life.

Sorry, if parents want smaller class size, and can afford it...hold them back, and get the best education...whats the problem...you're not paying for it.

LOL. You forgot to say - hold them back and get the best education...... but get them to play lacrosse with kids their own age and not the kids they are in class with. People on this forum aren't notIntelligent. Talent plays up with older kids to get better and lost parents hold their lost kids back to beat up on younger kids to inflate their own egos primarily and then to brag to their friends that little johnny scores 4 goals a game. Whats next, gender reassignment in 8th grade for boys so they can play with the girls that are 2 years younger?

Yeah. Life is not fair as we know. But it still stinks for your kid to not start or get cut because johnny repeated a grade or heldback. Why have age cutoffs if we are going to disregard them. Because my kid can't compete I should repeat and take opportunities from a younger kid? At the youth level it matters. High school is gloves off. But the holdback already stole 8 or 9 years of opportunities from other kids by the time 9th grade comes in lacrosse

If you can get your kid into an IVY or Duke, ND, UVA, Hop, etc. you have given them a path to change their life trajectory. That's what this is about. Not scholarship money. BTW, all of the above school are very generous with need based grants.

If holding back helps your chances then the ends justify the means. I get it's not fair because holding back isn't an option for some. Consider a PG. Most prep schools will offer free ride

Hockey does it right........travel hockey is grouped by birth year; you are born in 2008 you play with and against 08's whether you are in 7th grade or 5th.
The problem w/lacrosse being by grade is the 'cutoff' is different in every state and then the so called gray months become different as well. MD is Sept 1, so anyone born in the summer can choose to be the oldest in the class or go early and be the youngest. Long Island is Dec 1st, so their gray months become Sept, Oct and Nov. Irregardless when we give parents the option and age doesn't matter but rather grade, we will always get 12 year olds playing against 14 year olds.
HS kids should be graduating at 17/18, not 19, but if they allow it then parents will do it for any edge. It's the nature of the beast and we can complain all we want, but it's never going to change. FYI college coaches get you for 4 years, they would rather have you at 20, 21, 22 and 23, than 18, 19, 20 and 21.

Are we still arguing about this? Our boys are sophomores. They all understand the way the game is played. Most of our kids will just have to work harder to keep up with older kids on same grade club teams. If they don't become a famous lacrosse player but they learn ethics of hard work and teamwork they will be OK in life.

Nope. Kid is from Ohio where Sept 1 is school cutoff day for starting school. He should be one of the older 21s. If repeating 9th grade a Culver would land my kid at Harvard and I could pay for all that, yeah I do it and so would you. detest on the kid or his parents for reclassing but don't make stuff up. Whomever posted that M kid turning 18 is also posting false info. He'll be 17 and yes he reclassed. Exaggerating weakens your argument.

Let's change the topic....Which clubs are going to September Shootout this weekend, and are college recruiters?

All showcases, tourneys and recruitment events are coach/recruiter-free. Everything is done by video. So go buy a camera and start getting film on your kids, or purchase the game film if there is one available. There will be no in-person recruiting until Jan. 1 (at the earliest). Most, if not all, schools are focused on 2022's until they fill their rosters, which will take them into the new year. 23's are on the back burner until the 2021 summer and fall tourneys. What we should be doing at this point is getting film and a highlight reel together. We need to contact coaches of schools that our son's are interested in, relay that interest in their school and program, and inquire about their prospect camps. And, make sure our boys are hitting the gym and the books. That's how recruiting works these days if you're ranked outside the top 50.

If your kid is good enough to get into one of those ivy league schools to play lacrosse then there is no need to hold them back. What are they going to do when they are off to college and daddy isn't there to cheat for them? Probably fail.

Probably not. Older and more mature. Probably succeed with little difficulty.

My guess is they are hanging out at high school party's with duke lacrosse jackets on.

This conversation is so dense. If you move out of NY most of the kids are older because school starts in Aug and quite a few of the kids do not start K when they should so they are naturally older. It's been proven time and time again that collage coaches want older kids on campus so again pointless argument.

I get it it's not right that some are able to do it but most 17 year old kids have difficulty adapting to school at that level so if you have the means why not give them the best chance to succeed. You really believe the people doing this and going to those schools are thinking (PLL or BUST) come on people. We get it it's not for you but most of these parents had a plan in mind and it had nothing to do with their kids turning pro in Lax. I know it stings to see the commits form the kids you know are older and think man if my son had a year more he could have been that kid. Well you have the choice spend the money and hold him/her back.

Next topic

Holdbacks and reclassed kids - have fun graduating college at 25 years old. with

This is the reason lacrosse will not grow beyond a certain point and can only flourish so much. The rich/poor divide will never allow the sport to rise in popularity to the level of football, basketball and soccer. If holdbacks are the way to succeed and you need money to holdback/post-grad a kid then you are cutting out a ton of the population. There is no reason lax needs to be a country club sport.

Every HS sport has holdbacks....all for same reason...BETTER CHANCE AT A SCHOLORSHIP...it just that simple.

Maybe if you weren't held back you would know how to spell SCHOLARSHIP

Nope. It's the cost of equipment, club teams, tournaments & recruiting events. The soccer club system also excludes poor kids. I agree that lacrosse should be by age until high school. But looky here our boys are in HS and still people blather on about this. If your kid is a top D1 talent he'll get found regardless of age/club/school. If he's on the margins maybe just pick a D3 that fits his academics and he'll get to actually play. Or go to a big football school and play MCLA

Equipment is not expensive, club dues get compensated, its the parents like you that create the divide. I honestly have no idea what MCLA is, but I know my son loves lax and none of his friends have ever played as they see it as a rich white kids sport.

Lacrosse .... where rich parents screw over poor kids.

You are spot on. $3000 club fees, $500 showcase fees, $35,000 to PG, and clubs convincing kids they can't succeed without them. The bar has been raised to benefit the rich and 99% white kids. The underprivileged don't even try anymore and that's showing up on LI big time. 7 of the top 10 boys in the class of 2021 are private school kids, schools that cost $25,000 plus. How is that possible? How does it happen in any sports that 7 of the top 10 players are rich and white?

Can anyone give any advice on these Fall showcases for the 2023s? Is there any value in attending if college coaches aren't there? Thinking about signing my son up for one but these things are $500 and take up a whole day. Other than "getting used to the experience" is there any point as far as recruiting?

No, its a waste of money at this age group unless you are going to a showcase for a specific college.

Im not sure that anyone is looking at 2023's, but getting used to the experience is not a bad idea. It's also a great way to get film for his highlight reel that you'll need to send to coaches in the spring and summer. Get as much film as you possible can just in case the dead period extends again.

It's hilarious to see to see the expressions on some of these "Beachie Type, Karen Moms" when they walk on a field and see a team made up of majority of black kids. I wish there was more diversity...