BOTC - US Lacrosse Community Forum Forums NORTHEAST LACROSSE BOTC MAIN FORUM (LI, CT, WC) Boys 2020- 9th Grade Fall 2016/Summer 2017

Sorry the argument is inconvenient for you. A 14 yr old is not running his life any time soon. Perhaps your 16 yr old freshman is ready to leave the house to get away from you. [/quote]

Whining adults cause whining kids, just what the world needs more of..

Whining adults cause whining kids, just what the world needs more of.. [/quote] Just like we need more hold back cheaters.

Whining adults cause whining kids, just what the world needs more of..[/quote]

Correct. The holdback parents should stop whining. The posts above attempting to silence the argument is little more than the typist putting their fingers in their ears, stomping their feet, and saying "na na na na I can't hear you." Silencing the opposition is what passes for discourse these days. The practice of holding kids back has hurt the game. Is there really any dispute with that? If you have a holdback in high school now, you will not hear much complaining during school ball, but people know who has gamed the system. They will always be looked at with a jaded eye.

Correct. The holdback parents should stop whining. The posts above attempting to silence the argument is little more than the typist putting their fingers in their ears, stomping their feet, and saying "na na na na I can't hear you." Silencing the opposition is what passes for discourse these days. The practice of holding kids back has hurt the game. Is there really any dispute with that? If you have a holdback in high school now, you will not hear much complaining during school ball, but people know who has gamed the system. They will always be looked at with a jaded eye. [/quote]

Here's the problem, though. One thing to not like the rules, but another thing entirely to pretend that the parent of a kid that does pre-first at the age of 6 is gaming anything. Also not fair to assume that a 1st, 2nd, 3rd, 4th, etc.. grader is going to step up to the registration table and sign up for +1 grade above his own because one day, down the road, like in 6th/7th/8th grade when the competition starts getting more fierce, some whining parents are going to start screaming holdback, holdback, blah blah blah. In a grade based system, folks need to understand there are different school curriculums that need to meld together at some point.

I love all the holdback parents coming on here and somehow because 2020 is now a 'high school' year, then everything is all right and even again. (Despite not one 2020 has played a game in HS yet). If your 16 year old freshman is playing varsity this year, then more power to him and that can be respected, but during the upcoming summer season, if he's on a 2020 team, he will be at times playing against younger competition. And for your ego I hope he dominates.
But if you think as parents we are sometimes nasty about the subject, then you should hear our kids talk about local kids who have all of a sudden repeated for 'lacrosse reasons'.
I also understand that if your son goes to a Prep school then its almost a prerequisite that he repeats, but this is where lacrosse, and it's antiquated grade based system of summer tournaments, etc. has allowed many to game the system. Lacrosse is the only sport that comes to mind where the stigma of playing down during the travel season is somehow defended.

I have a 2021 who plays on decent B club, and is not even on the top middie line. He filled in on a 2022 A team last year and looked like Paul Rabil - I was under no illusion of his abilities and, in fact, I was embarrassed that I let him fill in. That is what holdbacks are doing the sport and, and even worse their parents are encouraging and defending the practice.

Here's the problem, though. One thing to not like the rules, but another thing entirely to pretend that the parent of a kid that does pre-first at the age of 6 is gaming anything. Also not fair to assume that a 1st, 2nd, 3rd, 4th, etc.. grader is going to step up to the registration table and sign up for +1 grade above his own because one day, down the road, like in 6th/7th/8th grade when the competition starts getting more fierce, some whining parents are going to start screaming holdback, holdback, blah blah blah. In a grade based system, folks need to understand there are different school curriculums that need to meld together at some point. [/quote] I think for the most part people have no issue with the pre-first and early year grade school decisions parents have made, but when it's done in the 8th/9th grade and done for purely lacrosse reasons, and in this current grade based system, then I think I can point out the absurdity of it. A local 2019 kid, who was on the 8th grade honor roll and only plays lacrosse, a strong, but short and slow kid where the game is slowly passing him by, repeats 8th grade (at a private school, only to come back to the public school) and now takes the spot of someone on the 2020 travel team. I'm sorry, there is something inherently wrong with that and I'm not sure that decision is made if lacrosse was on an age based system. (My son is on the original 2019 team so was not affected, but I can't help but roll my eyes.)

Here's the problem, though. One thing to not like the rules, but another thing entirely to pretend that the parent of a kid that does pre-first at the age of 6 is gaming anything. Also not fair to assume that a 1st, 2nd, 3rd, 4th, etc.. grader is going to step up to the registration table and sign up for +1 grade above his own because one day, down the road, like in 6th/7th/8th grade when the competition starts getting more fierce, some whining parents are going to start screaming holdback, holdback, blah blah blah. In a grade based system, folks need to understand there are different school curriculums that need to meld together at some point. [/quote] I think for the most part people have no issue with the pre-first and early year grade school decisions parents have made, but when it's done in the 8th/9th grade and done for purely lacrosse reasons, and in this current grade based system, then I think I can point out the absurdity of it. A local 2019 kid, who was on the 8th grade honor roll and only plays lacrosse, a strong, but short and slow kid where the game is slowly passing him by, repeats 8th grade (at a private school, only to come back to the public school) and now takes the spot of someone on the 2020 travel team. I'm sorry, there is something inherently wrong with that and I'm not sure that decision is made if lacrosse was on an age based system. (My son is on the original 2019 team so was not affected, but I can't help but roll my eyes.) [/quote]

Any reasonable person would agree with you on that example.

wait till you see how many hold backs come out of the wood work when they pass the ne wrecruiting rules in April. Coaches cant talk to the kids till September of JR year

Imagine the good things you guys could do for this world instead of obsessing over the ages of boys.

I think for the most part people have no issue with the pre-first and early year grade school decisions parents have made, but when it's done in the 8th/9th grade and done for purely lacrosse reasons, and in this current grade based system, then I think I can point out the absurdity of it. A local 2019 kid, who was on the 8th grade honor roll and only plays lacrosse, a strong, but short and slow kid where the game is slowly passing him by, repeats 8th grade (at a private school, only to come back to the public school) and now takes the spot of someone on the 2020 travel team. I'm sorry, there is something inherently wrong with that and I'm not sure that decision is made if lacrosse was on an age based system. (My son is on the original 2019 team so was not affected, but I can't help but roll my eyes.) [/quote]

Any reasonable person would agree with you on that example. [/quote]

Age based eliminates this argument forever. Just like every other legitimate sport...

But I keep reading on BOTC that High Sxhool teams can beat D3 teams. Kind of kills the argument about hold backs

Or just obsessing over boys...

True dat

If you are against holdbacks why did you let him play? You take a stand against something and then you do it? Hmmmm, you're lying!!

I let him play because the team was having a hard time getting enough players to play that day, and considering his talent, I didn't think he would be THAT much better, if at all, than the younger A players. To be clear, I am against the premise of holdbacks playing regularly for nominally younger teams. My son is not a holdback, and it was one game, and I didn't let him do it again, even though he was asked to a couple more times. Not even close to the same thing as having your son play day-in-day-out with younger kids. See the difference?

No, take a stand, don't let him play down at all. You now let other parents see the advantage of holdback because your son dominated the game. See the point!!

Did you miss where I said I wouldn't let him do it again??

Bunch of snowflakes on this site.

The real snowflakes can't deal with reality and has to have their "superstar" kid play against other kids 12-24 months younger in order to compete. Now go back to work before your millennial boss catches you.

Your son FILLED in so the team could get a win. If they didn't have the players they should have forfeited! I personally don't care about holdbacks. When my son was in 7th grade he played in a HS tournament. He held his own. Certainly didn't dominate, but didn't get beat up either. I would never allow him to FILL in against younger kids.

The hold back thing drove me crazy when my son was younger. The amoral parents don't care and sadly, neither do the coaches. It is here to stay. Try to control what you can control and don't let that issue diminish the joy you are experiencing with your children. If you want to worry about something, worry about arriving at the Notre Dame prospect day and seeing a ton of unbelievably good players from teams and places you have never heard of in the central and western US and Canada. The sport is growing so fast that I think opportunities to play D1, let alone D3 will be very, very scarce in another 5-10 years. Good luck.

Work? I'm washing the IROC in the carport today. Snowflake.

What is all of this snowflake talk? Is this some type of racist slander like cracker or honky?

If pathetic liberal butthurt losers were a race, then yes, it is racist slander.

ADVNC SF
Alcatraz Outlaws
Annapolis Hawks
C2C Lacrosse
Carolina Cannons
Cincy Royals 2020 Elite
Crabs
Eclipse
EDGE
FCA
Juiced Cherries
Laxachusetts
Leading Edge
LI Bluefish
LI Express
LI Express North
Looney's
Madlax
MD Roughriders
Next Level
NH Tomahawks
PA Roughriders
Patriot 2020
Philadelphia Freedom
Resolute
SoCal Express
Team 91
Team Igloo
Team Minnesota
Team ONE
UC Mavericks
VLC
That's the sold out field for Crabfeast. This event should put the rest some of the discussions over the pecking order in this group.

you know if Team 91 is Crush or 91 MD?

They didn't win, so, in the end, it was moot!

Which 91 team matters.

That sunday is start of 20s showtime. we're doing showtime. curious how this overlap is going to affect both.

So.....it's a political thing then?

Listen, I apologize. No way you are a snowflake if you have an IROC and carport.

The loopy lefties gave us this gem after the election defeat, now used for anyone that you consider weak, whiny, sore loser, can't get over anything you don't agree with, etc..

Got it, thanks.

If a team really can't fill out their roster I would much rather them bring other kids in even if the were a little older than have them forfeit. The point of youth athletics is to compete and get better not to "win" by forfeit. Usually teams that are short aren't very good anyway. It sounds like in this situation everyone benefited from the boy playing down by having a more competitive game rather than a blowout or a forfeit. I realize that some teams abuse any discretion by bringing in a bunch of older kids, blowing everyone out and then talking about how great they are but it doesn't sound like that is what happened here.

Cant disagree with your Logic. Its when it is abuse like anythign else it becomes the cancer. Play your skill level or slightly above and you get better. again keeping it competitive where anyone could win

The part you miss is all the other parents seeing the "older" kid dominate. What do you think these people take away from this?

Its 89+2 Long island attending.

They take away their son played a good competitive game which is better than blowing someone out or staying home playing xbox because the other team forfeited. I assume they already knew older kids or kids who hit puberty early have an advantage.

Still could just be Orange and not Crush