BOTC - US Lacrosse Community Forum Forums National Premier Youth Lacrosse League - Spring 2014

The lacrosse people in Maryland should get a prominent lax guy who graduated from Hopkins or U of M to run for governor. Then he can pass a law that kids can't start kindergarten until they are 6 years old instead of 5. This way you don't have to tell your middle school children who are doing well in school, but aren't lacrosse stars in their grade that they are going to repeat 7th or 8th grade so that they might get a partial scholarship for lacrosse in a few years.

If there is no money or free rides out there then why is everyone so mad about "cheating"?

Don't the kids get made fun of for being left back, even if others know they are doing it for lax? I would think the lax players that stayed on age, would laugh those kids out of the water- or is it that prominent- that sooo many kids do it? I also cannot fathom telling my kid who works his butt off in school for excellent grades; he needs to add another year to his schooling before college. Maybe some towns/schools are just more sports oriented and not academic oriented? The only kids I know that have ever been left back for a sport did so in HS and repeated 12th grade at a prep school. This seems more reputable, as you know the college wants you, but you need to prove yourself for one more year, as opposed to gambling whether or not your kid gets noticed playing with younger kids. I am wondering how many kids end up not doing as well as they hoped and if they could do it again would they- or is the success rate that high that only a small fraction fail to get into a better school. This is really a whole different culture and way of thinking. I still say go for academics, but best of luck to you all. And the questions asked were not to be obnoxious, really I am rather interested in the answers.

because the LI dads have to make themselves feel better by claiming the MD teams are cheating to win.

They also complain about the bad officiating, weather conditions, phase of the moon, etc.

Any excuse besides their kids aren't good

You just won the award for dumbest post of all time...

I couldn't care less about officiating, weather, etc. The holdback situation in MD is really pathetic. I would be embarrassed to watch my kid play against younger kids and then act like they're great. The simple way to do youth sports up until they reach high school is to do it based on age. Each team should have to play in the age group based on the oldest kid on their team. To throw out an early 2001 kid on the field against teams made up of predominantly 2002 kids is pathetic, yet it happens all the time (pick whatever age group you want). It likely won't be fixed until some kid gets seriously injured and the tournaments realize the waiver forms won't hold up in a law suit. Size and speed are the real issues with playing down, put a kid out there who is small and he can be managed, but playing a kid who is bigger, faster, stronger with average stick skills, only because he's a year older, is lame.

You are an idiot. Almost all youth tournaments are age based.

It is amazing that you guys focus 100% of your lives on this non-issue.

what post is this in response to? use the "quote" button so people know next time...

This is pure nonsense. If a kid graduates from a top school with good grades nobody is going to care if he was held back, skipped a grade, or played for Crush.

When was the last time a team "only" from MD won the U-15 Championship??? UHHHH never, FCA won it with LI kids on the team, sorry, try again. That ol birth certificate rule always seems to get in the way with you guys.... Too funny.

MIAA Rules require that a player be U-19 eligible during the academic year they are playing. This implies that a 2x holdback will not be able to participate in school sports his senior year. Are there really examples of Kindergarten red-shirts who also reclassify in 8th grade? These players would not be U-15 eligible during their 2nd 8th grade year.

I assume most athletic assocations have similar age rules. Perhaps players do not care if they play for their HS as a senior???

I am not sure I like the reclassify term. I think of it as taking a Middle School Post Grad year before starting HS.

There is a boy who was top of his class in 8th grade, among the tops in 9th grade, left after the school year to repeat 9th grade (at BL), you are going to tell me that is for the benefit of his education (and oh yeah, he's a Crab as well)...2 more left private school after 9th to repeat at...drum roll please...BL...and both will be Crabs next year. Nice work BL, nice work Crabs, both embarrassing examples of what this sport has become.

Its called Sarcism!

What is "The" U15 Championship?

What is "sarcism?"

There are 2 Crabs that fall under this category (that I know of), 1 '17 and 1 '18 (recently "reclassified")

That is a total of 3 boys out of how many playing lacrosse in Baltimore? Unless you have hard proof of this happening in other programs, don't paint the rest of Baltimore with that brush.

I think the poster was clear that the Crabs were the main perpetrator

There is so much BS on this thread. 50% of the posts are from FCA dads who are upset that they don't get invited to Crabs tournaments, so they make up all these lies.

good luck with that...

After watching the World Games tonight, I think the U.S. should level the playing field and stop using holdbacks.

Crab Dad took off his son's Crab gloves and put down his beer to type something, and of course it is attacking FCA. Did you learn to type in your 3rd round of 8th grade at BL as well?

You need some new material.

From Long Island, never played FCA, have played Crabs...I do find it a disgrace that the Crab organization encourages boys to stay back. Is that part of their recruiting strategy. I get the notion that at college the age difference doesn't matter, but sadly, parents are buying into the notion it is better for their kids.

First of all, I really don’t think this problem is as prevalent as some posters have expressed. If you look at the rosters (including birthdays) of some of these “elite” teams, I think most readers would be shocked at how many of those big and fast dudes are actually age and grade appropriate. 1) Some kids are going to be huge PERIOD. 2) Some kids mature earlier and faster than others, and 3) some kids are just soo freakin’ good, it’s hard to believe they aren't “cheating”.

That said, some do hold back. For every kid that holds back for athletic advantage in Middle School, there is likely a more talented but less developed kid who is grade appropriate and was left off of the roster. What’s interesting about this problem is that the advantage created by holding kids back is only temporary. At some point Johnny catches up to Billy, and the advantage isn't there any more. Big deal. Right?

WRONG… the temporary advantage occurs at a very pivotal time for the kids. This is when high school club teams are solidifying their rosters for the next four years. Even the most mercenary of club program directors would like as little turnover as possible after the U15 season. They want to focus on getting their athletes recruited, building their brand, and keeping the machine running.

The temporary advantage also occurs precisely when NCAA coaches who get paid to “pick winners” are out trying to identify the next group of middle school athletes who will keep them gainfully employed for the next few years. Bottom line -- the coaches are at risk. Older kids are bigger, stronger, and faster than younger kids… temporarily. Bigger, stronger, faster kids present less risk … specifically during recruiting evaluations.

The temporary advantage issue is here to stay. The “self-preservation engines” are now running hard. Too many people in youth lacrosse have too much to lose at this point - the kids, the club program directors, and the NCAA coaches. There won’t be any grassroots momentum reversals as long as there are such obvious tangible benefits to stakeholders PERIOD. The only two entities which have the ability to reverse this trend (by setting rigid single-year, age-based divisions) are the tournament and league directors, but why would they!

FCA is just as guilty! As is Club Blue, Hawks, MadLax and VLC. It is a privilege and a right apparently among most of the private school kids in the Baltimore and DC area.

Can someone explain the animosity between the Crabs and the FCA? It seems both clubs can coexist in an area flush with talented lacrosse players

Well said. Here is a good article on the topic focused on DC and Md:

http://deadspin.com/why-rich-lacrosse-parents-are-making-their-kids-repeat-1570381983

Crabs threatened by FCA encroaching upon their domain as typically having the best teams in Maryland. FCA upset that Crabs will not allow FCA to play in their very high caliber tournaments (Crab Feast & Young Guns)or schedule regular games / scrimmages. There is enough talent in the area for both to thrive and enjoy a healthy rivalry. Crabs well established and FCA in 2nd year of local existence.

Correct except that the Crabs are not threatened at all by FCA.

Human Head Discovered In Hempstead Yard
Pair of Arms Also Found In Same Residential Area Of Long Island Last Week.....and these bozo's are worried about re-classification?

That's right, Baltimore is crime free. It's the armpit of the east coast.

It is Calvert Hall against Boy's Latin

Held my boy back in 5th grade after trying home schooling with mixed results. Has given him some time to mature vs others kids who have mustaches at age 12.

It has helped him in athletics and academics.
What's the big deal?

No it's not.

I home schooled my boy for 7 years and now he is back in 5th grade with mixed results. He is going to kick [lacrosse] at the 2020 tournaments this Fall, and it is a huge plus that he can drive himself to tournaments.

How do Breakers avoid all this local vitriol? Are they just really nice people or just so bad at lacrosse that FCA and Crabs would rather beat up on each other?

Is too

The difference is, your boy had mixed results with homeschooling and had you continued on within the same grade, he would have had gaps and would have suffered academically. He gained maturity, the gift of time and athletic advantage because of the homeschool mishap. This is different than holding your kid back just for athletic advantage, which many parents are doing. Terrible message to teach your kid IMHO- academics should always come first, not athletics. If your kid struggles academically, then maybe you have no other avenue, but certainly for the avg to above avg student, it is not a good move academically, if not needed.

Because the Breakers are a non-factor overall.