BOTC - US Lacrosse Community Forum Forums National Premier Youth Lacrosse League - Spring 2014

This is why us Madlax parents pay the extra money. We might not agree with who or what Maddox picks. But we are for sure its picking the best players. I have seen him put kids that go to top private schools on his Blue/single A team so a "poor" public school kid can make his AA/ orange team. He has his issues but the best players play and thats all the parents should be asking for. So should I be looking for lots of VLC helmets at this summer madlax tryouts?

I echo that about madlax. The guy who runs it can be a jerk, but there is very little (I cannot say no) politics and he plays who he thinks can win. He also coaches well.

I have no grudge against VLC and would like to see them succeed. Have many friends playing for them.

Different poster here...I think you will see bunches of VLC helmets at Fall tryouts for 3d and will see some very elite VLC HS players at 3d tournaments later this Summer. Don't know about MadLax, but take your point as given. Once these kids are in 8th grade or higher the town or school bias is bad. The kids who put a lot into this deserve fair.

Madlax parents pay the extra money because Maddux put that policy in place to keep families beholden to him. The idea that Madlax is some saintly organization is a farce.

Noone called him a saint, including the MadLax posters. If he put a policy in place to not be political and to roster and play the best kids, then you are correct that the MadLax parents are beholden to that. I don't think any lacrosse club is rub b uhh saints BTW, and we all know this going in.

Yep Cabbel is no saint, but even with the new NPYLL age rules for Single A teams he still put his top players on his Orange teams and filled out the Blue rosters with the remaining players.

Some older kids got the ax, even though he could have played them up in AA and kept their $$

Agree with the posters re: Madlax. While Madlax and Cabell may not be for everyone, if you are a top player 1) you will get selected and 2) you will get playing time. Cabell is personally very involved in roster selection. Additionally, I have seen many kids start with Madlax on Blue, or B, teams and move up to the Orange teams. The converse is true too. If you are not a top player, you will not get on the top teams or see the field, and may move down to a lower level team. Very few, if any returning players ever get cut.
For all of the nonsense I have seen in youth sports, Daddy-ball and politics, Madlax is the one place that seems to do it best.

That's the way it should be best players play first.

11u aa blc over hawks

Who's going to win the U13AA this year. Madlax is starting slow but winning games. Crabs and Hawks still have not played but they are both putting up big scores. Who's the second best team in the Red Div. ?

After the game the Hawk boys went home and played with legos and the Crab boys drove themselves to the Greene Turtle for lunch

Does this guy know that BLC is not the Crabs?

blc = Bethesda Lax Club, but keep trying

Yeah what an a s s.

Looking like madlax, crabs, hawks and zingos at u 15. I don't know much about the zingos. Madlax and hawks in two weeks should be a good game.

Here is a new Deadspin POOP Show to talk bad about kids/teams or people we all know. http://deadspin.com/why-rich-lacrosse-parents-are-making-their-kids-repeat-1570381983

Stupid article

Kids of all demographics hold their kids back for various reasons

Inner city basketball players
Country folk football players
Latin baseball players

All are older

All of them except for the over 98% of the population that attends school correct to their birth year. And inner city basketball players never do this if they are strong enough to play pro. Those kids are eager to go out and want to play up not down.

Nice try. Facts got in the way. The article is completely fair.

Well the not fair part is they name kids by there name which is way way out of line. And the funny thing is no one says its on fair when a kids birthday make him the oldest kid in his grade. There is no cheating when the kid is 19 not 18. When someone finds a way to have a 20 year old kid play. Then that will be cheating. The other funny thing is no one is mad if a team has mostly sophomores and they play a team of all seniors. So would you like high school sports to have four teams and have them be by age. That sounds the most fair way to me. So what would you do if your son was not very smart and he got offered to play at a 35k school for half or more off. These school are not easy schools the extra year could help not smart kids to be ready. It all sounds like sour grapes to me.

I understand why kids are reclassified, but it does not seem to be fair in the spirit of fair play. My son has played on two elite travel programs within the past two years, but is not one of the elite players on the team. If he reclassified, he would probably be an elite player on that team the following year. But what is the point and what are you teaching the kid?

Seems like Karma to me. I'm all for calling out cheaters.

Sorry, but your facts are incorrect

http://www.nj.com/hssports/blog/boy...ing_back_in_middle_school_to_get_an.html

"And players repeating grades is not restricted to New Jersey. At least three of the top 12 players in the 2013 class nationally — Andrew Wiggins, Noah Vonleh and Wayne Seldon — repeated a grade. The No. 2 overall rated player in 2012, Nerlens Noel, also repeated."

"Coaches say the repeating trend has been going on for more than a decade — if not even longer. But the past five years, the fad has ramped up.

For instance, last season the St. Michael’s CYO AAU team from Union City won the 14-and-under state title. Afterward, Hurley said nearly the entire team repeated the eighth grade."

Me thinks you nailed it. Not just DC lacrosse players; it is anyone who wants an edge. It isn't cheating until it violates a rule.

Congrats, that's the dumbest statement I've ever read on this forum (and there have been some doozies). Reclassing creates an unfair edge which is the exact definition of cheating.

They are not 20 year old seniors they are 19 year old seniors and the rule has been for at least 25 years that you could only be 19 and play high school sports. Using that logic you can not hire a personal trainer because all the kids do not have a personal trainer. Its not cheating its looking out for your kid which is what parents should do look out for the best for there kid. They are not giving them drugs to get better they are giving them a edge to help them get to where they want to get. So if they do it when the kid is going into school and they hold them back that year is that cheating? Ok how about doing 1st grade twice is that cheating. I just want to know what year you do twice is cheating so I do not get called names on a lacrosse forum.

If your kid is that good there is no reason to hold them back.

Please distinguish an unfair edge from a fair edge?

unfair - reclassing, using steroids
fair - working harder than the next kid, not cutting corners, not taking the easy way out even if it's technically within the rules

Well said - totally agree! I want my son to work harder to become bigger, faster, stronger and better! Not send a message to him that it is okay to step back and compete against predominantly younger kids. A life lesson!

That is a very thoughtful comment. I am a MD parent. I know that this cure epidemic of parents pulling this nonsense around here is also the case in other regions. And all the apologists saying well hockey players and baseball players do it too just rationalizes taking short cuts to success. People who don't do that resent it at every level. I remember a baseball pitcher throwing Sosa and McGuire under the bus for roids...it is not just the glory those guys got for cheating...it was the money and years taken away from the pitchers with lower stats throwing to roided out players, and the hitters who had lower stats because they didn't roid out. It comes around eventually. A lot of the 16 year old 2017 commits are going to see when they get to college that being 18 months older or younger doesn't mean anything anymore in college. The best players don't need a crutch now. And those are the players who will play in college

Let us bring this conversation back around to the title of this thread, NPY LL. As everyone seems to be obsessed with the reclass issue, I would like to hear from others how many reclassifes are on each team.

I am particularly interested in the crabs, the Hawks, and club blue.

"A lot of the 16 year old 2017 commits are going to see when they get to college that being 18 months older or younger doesn't mean anything anymore in college. The best players don't need a crutch now. And those are the players who will play in college."

You may be mistaken on this point. At least one of the Thompson phenoms is 23 years old. While age may not be the determining factor in his success, clearly, it does not seem to hurt him.

It only makes a difference once you get to High School teams - NPYLL is age based, not grade based

Interesting point - the Thompsons don't strike me as being rich prep school types and yet there must be a hold back/repeat somewhere along the line

So only the Long Island families play by the rules. Of course they are also the ones that complain the most at every game about how bad the refs are so they must know the rules better than everyone else

It is almost impossible to become noticeably bigger of faster through hard work. Those are largely due to genetics. Maybe you can add a few lbs of useful muscle with training, and shave a tenth or do off your forty time. So, when it comes to size and speed, both of which are very important elements of the sport, you either got them from your parents or didn't. Now that doesn't seem very "fair" does it?

Except at the u15 level it can make a difference. It is a two year window, which only matters if you have an unusually old eighth grader-a reclass for example. The u15 group is what I am interested in.

Agree that kids are going to have natural advantages over other kids - thats life! But reclassifying is a means of circumventing the natural order.

The natural order or the arbitrary cutoff that has been chosen to choose which players should be lumped together

I presume you oppose college redshirts as well.

The last two commits where 100% on point. Also no one ever answered if its cheating if they hold there kid back in first grade. Or is it only cheating if its done in 8th grade????