BOTC - US Lacrosse Community Forum Forums NORTHEAST LACROSSE BOTC MAIN FORUM (LI, CT, WC) Boys 2029-7th Grade Fall 2023/Summer 2024

This may be the densest statement yet. People are “fools and jealous” because they don’t see the “value” in holding back. So let’s start a new thread about “value” vs “cost”

Value
-gets to dominate against younger kids
-an extra year of maturity and maybe get their academics in order
-maybe, just maybe, but unlikely to translate into getting into a top d1 school
-parents get a sense a pride and boast how awesome their kid is

Cost
-you are telling their kid they can’t compete on a level playing field. Usually the parent and maybe the kid won’t ever realize this
-less skill development because you are competing against a less skilled cohort rather than on age
-all those friends he grew up with, say goodbye and here’s a whole new group of players
-this actually a literal cost as holding back may cost in the form of an extra year of tuition and extra year of club
-another literal cost of deferring a year’s worth of income down the road
-teaching a life’s lesson to game the system and cut corners to get ahead. Again most won’t realize it.

Everybody has different goals in life but to me, the “value” just doesn’t outweigh the “costs”. t’s lacrosse. It just makes no sense. Maybe basketball or football but makes zero sense for lacrosse.

Who wants to add to the list of perceived value and costs?

As someone else already said, to be a dominant d1 lacrosse player, you have to hold back. But the problem is the majority of holdbacks don’t go in to be a dominant player. You are so myopic you are only looking at the numerator and not the denominator. And as been already said, it’s lacrosse. A niche sport that the majority of the world doesn’t care about. Why would you holdback a year in this sport. Pride makes you do silly things sometimes. My feelings aren’t hurt my kid didn’t become a superstar as an on age athlete. He is doing quite fine.

Some good points on value vs cost. I think the holdback scenario works for some and not others each family has different reasons. With that said not sure i understand the holdback thought process but as a parent of a 2029 i know we will be forced to watch our children play against older kids this year and from what i hear it gets even worse next year. Even if we dont agree with it or apply rational thinking towards it we have no control over it.

As someone else already said, to be a dominant d1 lacrosse player, you have to hold back. [/quote]

6 of 11 Notre Dame recruits in the class of 2025 are NOT holdbacks. Their birthdates are on Inside Lacrosse. 6 of the 11 could have played in the World Series with the class of 2025 meaning they were born after 9/1/2006. Of the 5 that wouldn't have qualified for the WS, 2 were born in August '06 so they barely missed the cutoff.

Moral of the story . . . no, you do not have to hold back to be recruited to a top program or be a dominant D1 player. This is a falsehood holdback parents tell themselves and their kids to justify their decision.

#realstudsdontreclass

Here's the list . . .

2025
Iuliano Mar-07
Lally Oct-05
Kelley Aug-06
Diaz-Matos Jan-06
Lynch Feb-07
Gardner Nov-06
Mullahy Oct-06
Iglesias Feb-07
Popham Aug-06
Gryzenia Nov-06
Kenney Jun-06

Express is obviously not great at 29 but most kids are 2011.

For now anyway.

That list proves you should holdback My 25 was born in aug 07 How does he compete with Oct 05? That’s a double holdback Unfortunately you’re just adding to the holdback case with the info above the players within reason are still on the older side for 25s Bad example

I can’t recall any top Express team that stunk. So just relax. It’s 7th grade lax, which is basically meaningless games that nobody remembers

Because they are older.

Give it up. You cannot justify this one way or the other. Every parent makes their own decisions. Like the other poster said, control what you can and worry about your own situation but be realistic about the outcome. LI public kids used to walk onto NCAA programs. The landscape has changed with more areas are producing top talent. The undersized LI kid with great skills will be overlooked by the stronger and faster older kids from other regions.

:"2029 is an awful class on the island, very little talent.[/quote]:

Wow.. You're quite the analyst. I would say you are badly in need of a hoppy pal..

So you agree that holdbacks are better lacrosse players. Regardless of the circumstances they are better than on age athletes. Therefore those prized scholarships at the “top tier” schools go to the private school holdback. Not your public school on age.

6 of 11 Notre Dame recruits in the class of 2025 are NOT holdbacks. Their birthdates are on Inside Lacrosse. 6 of the 11 could have played in the World Series with the class of 2025 meaning they were born after 9/1/2006. Of the 5 that wouldn't have qualified for the WS, 2 were born in August '06 so they barely missed the cutoff.

Moral of the story . . . no, you do not have to hold back to be recruited to a top program or be a dominant D1 player. This is a falsehood holdback parents tell themselves and their kids to justify their decision.

#realstudsdontreclass

Here's the list . . .

2025
Iuliano Mar-07
Lally Oct-05
Kelley Aug-06
Diaz-Matos Jan-06
Lynch Feb-07
Gardner Nov-06
Mullahy Oct-06
Iglesias Feb-07
Popham Aug-06
Gryzenia Nov-06
Kenney Jun-06[/quote]

Some of these may take a PG year essentially being stashed for a year making them a holdback. Quite common so I will be curious which of these will actually be in the roster of fall 2025

Give what up? You seem to be arguing with yourself. The value and costs are simply a list. Some think the value is better the cost and most see the cost as too much for the perceived value. I am merely making a list and asking people to add to their own value and costs or holding back. But if you are the [Censored] saying all parents are fools because “they don’t see the value in holdbacks”, I’m pointing out they aren’t fools because they see more of a cost associated with it. And I clearly said that “everyone has different values” so I’m not worried the least bit about controlling what other parents do

I would agree that a kid at 13 yrs old is better than the same kid at 12 years old. Holdbacks are cheaters. Most people when they find out you held back will give you no credit for anything you accomplish because you are a cheater.

Give me a break. $3.8 billion dollars was given last year in athletic scholarships for ALL sports. Over $48 billion was given in academic scholarships plus another $5 billion from the private sector. If that’s your justification on how to get money for college, get a tutor instead of holding him back for a “niche” sport. So clueless it boggles my mind.

Your cost / benefit analysis needs work. There are no facts, just feelings. Remove your feelings and you have nothing to base your pathetic rambling on. Big deal that you feel holdbacks are cheaters - noone cares.

You are a fraud becuase you cant come up with any reasons yourself. I think the list does a good job detailing why one should hold back and why one shouldnt. I am against holdbacks because I think it is contributing to the demise of the sport and it would be much better off if everyone just played on age. But i guess reading comprehension is tough tor you becuse I have detailed some reasons why some kids should holdback as it will benefit some but not most. But I can see your reason for holdbacks: daddy ego. Nothing else is relevant to you. Living your life through your child and that is the worst "pros" for doing it. Whats pathetic is your response; care to contribute something a little more than your ego? As to saying no one cares? I think there are a ton of people who care. "No one"? Ha, what an obtuse lost,

This guy brain dead?

You say alot but it’s all conjecture and opinion. If it is causing the demise of the sport, why do so many who have contributed to the game’s growth condone the practice? Most Coaches have done this with their own children and all D1 Coaches will continue to recruit the best eligible players, regardless of age. The truth is obvious and your little man crusade will go nowhere. Good luck to your B team JV son against the older, stronger, and faster.

6 of 11 Notre Dame recruits in the class of 2025 are NOT holdbacks. Their birthdates are on Inside Lacrosse. 6 of the 11 could have played in the World Series with the class of 2025 meaning they were born after 9/1/2006. Of the 5 that wouldn't have qualified for the WS, 2 were born in August '06 so they barely missed the cutoff.

Moral of the story . . . no, you do not have to hold back to be recruited to a top program or be a dominant D1 player. This is a falsehood holdback parents tell themselves and their kids to justify their decision.

#realstudsdontreclass

Here's the list . . .

2025
Iuliano Mar-07
Lally Oct-05
Kelley Aug-06
Diaz-Matos Jan-06
Lynch Feb-07
Gardner Nov-06
Mullahy Oct-06
Iglesias Feb-07
Popham Aug-06
Gryzenia Nov-06
Kenney Jun-06[/quote]


And here I thought 2025s would have been born in 2007….lol

Is your kid a subpar player?

Anyone who spends this much time on this site going back and forth about 7th grade lacrosse is brain dead, that includes you!!!

Taking this to another level. Full disclosure that it’s third hand but was told that a prominent team in the tristate is pushing HGH on middle schoolers to accelerate puberty, and parents are agreeing to it…

[quote=Anonymous}

2025
Iuliano Mar-07
Lally Oct-05
Kelley Aug-06
Diaz-Matos Jan-06
Lynch Feb-07
Gardner Nov-06
Mullahy Oct-06
Iglesias Feb-07
Popham Aug-06
Gryzenia Nov-06
Kenney Jun-06[/quote]

In NY the age cutoff for 2025 was 12/06. Based on this list ,3 kids were age eligible for 2025 - the rest would be called cheaters by the moronic LI lax Dad thinking his som his going to play at ND.

Why are you on here? Shouldn’t you be calling the school to hold your kid back again?

I think reclass Dad is right. Let’s all reclass our kids. Wonder how good reclass Dads kid will be when the whole grade reclasses?

Ha. Listen to yourself. Why do so many people who are getting rich want to keep getting richer? I’m gonna let you try and figure this out on your own but I’m not holding out up based on your level of intelligence..:

Don’t worry. He will double reclass. The longer he can live through his sons achievements the better.

29 group is so bad it would help to bring some talent down

Seems like the children are posting here.

I was the OP of the ND data.

I agree that some of these kids will likely do a PG year, but thats not the point. The argument was made that you HAD to holdback to play big time D1. Most of these boys earned a spot at ND without holding back.

If you atr truly elite you dont have to hold back to go big10, ACC, Ivy.

Unfortunately your argument about ND is void, almost all of them are older, youngest is March, most are over age and the ones that arent will PG. So yes, while they have talent they are not ready. There is nothing wrong with holding back, this conversation/argument needs to end. It’s a reality in this sport whether you like it or not and it’s only going to get worse. Club owners and directors see dollars not birthdates and until they are forced to apply dates to grad years it will continue. Yes there are dates for 14u and under, but after that it’s the Wild West. Need to adapt and or accept.

Long Island is loaded at 29. Not 1-2 dominate team. 5 very good and 2-3 others good.

You're funny. Most are ON AGE as documented with the facts above . . . but don't let the facts get in the way of your narrative.

I'm not judging folks that choose to hold back. And I don't disagree with your comments about the financial motivations of club owners.

I'm just simply disproving the myth that holding back is the only route to big time D1. In reality the most talented kids will end up at the top schools whether they held back or not.

Yes, not going to say names but will share a clue. The initials B, B, L are in the name. It’s not a secret within the club.

That’s tough to believe I am not sure BBL would want that liability surrounding them I can see parents who are fool pushing it but not a club owner or director This seems far fetched

I’ve heard this as well and it blows my mind. The long term consequences of this kind of therapy is a complete unknown. The fact that it is widely accepted by the BBL families is a major red flag. Any NJ tourist perusing this board, please get the word out that this is completely F’d.

You’re a fool if you believe this troll.

Express and 91 going to WS qualifiers?

That seems pretty dead and just a sad tournament now.