BOTC - US Lacrosse Community Forum Forums MID-ATLANTIC LACROSSE MARYLAND FORUM Boys 2028 Grads - Mid Atlantic Region

Not a surprise, we all know the DMV teams cheat.

You're basically repeating back to me what I wrote--there's no way to check what grade a player is in, regardless of the level of tournament, without getting some sort of official document from the player's school verifying what grade the kid is in. This is obviously unworkable for leagues or tournaments with hundreds to thousands of registered players.

All the leagues (Hoco included) and the big tournaments (NAL and NLF) rely on players/parents registering and self-reporting, so they can take it as "seriously" as they like but cannot enforce anything. And yes, I have experience over the last decade with multiple sons in Hoco (including Elite) and NAL/NLF tourneys.

The only other check--as I wrote above--is when players recognize opposing players who attend their same school and know that they're in an older grade. That's how 2026 Madlax DMV was busted a few years ago. The World Series example isn't relevant since it's age based, not grade.

Not saying it's right or I condone it, but there's no good way to enforce the grad year restrictions other than honor system and/or classmates reporting someone they know is overage.

Hysterical the statement there is very little cheating going on. If your teams travel at all to tournaments, age and class cheating is more the norm than the exception. Other regions just don't grow kids larger than they do in this area. The kids talk both on and off the field and you will find 4-5 players per team on the more well known teams with older players both in age and class. There is no checking. Usually, those name brand teams need players to fill out their rosters and they get the older players to be more competitive.

The Crabs went to Sand Storm this past year and they were posting on social media. Someone forgot to tell them to omit the pictures of the older class Crabs kids playing and in the team huddles. Sometimes, a kid will say his parents are considering re-classing him but that's not allowed either.

Pay close attention to WSL. The rosters of those name brand teams are remarkably different and physically smaller than the teams you'll see in Frederica or elsewhere. I am pretty sure a team could challenge every roster in the out of town tournaments and find a forfeit in 75%.

I know most elite teams have several older kids due to holdbacks, but that is within the rules. However, this scenario where teams have multiple kids playing down on a younger grade team even though they haven't reclassed in school is a new phenomenon to me. This is flat cheating.

I can't imagine 75% of of the DMV elite teams do this. All of these kids/families know each other. If the Hawks '28 team had a kid that was actually in 8th grade this year, I'd have to think the other HOCO teams would know this and call them out. LE can get away with it because most other top teams don't know their kids or grades. Embarrassing lack of integrity by Leading Edge and the families doing this.

What is age cheating?

If it had anything to do with kids education you would play your kid in his correct age group. Instead you are gaming the system. Did you set your kid up to play against younger kids? You badass you. I got it, you're this hard working winner, sending your kid to a school he clearly doesn't belong in, and making up for it by having him beat down on kids he's older than. Mocking the lazy, lost middle class parents that you are clearly better than. O'Doyles rule right? Both the Bernie guys and the Trump guys despise you.

This is the same guy that screams "Blue Collar Mentality" after gaming the system, to have his kid play against younger kids. You win sir.

My son plays on one of the dreaded "national teams" and we met parents from 2? 3? New England teams this summer who do this...."he's going to reclass eventually, so we just started playing him down."

Honestly at least they were transparent about it, unlike MD and PA holdback parents who at best are very quiet about their reclassed son's age, and at worst, will lie to your face about it. Hilarious last winter, spring and summer where numerous hotshot 2028s posted on IG about their 13th birthdays, then mom/dad rushed to delete the post/reel an hour or two later. Nothing to see here!

What team does your son play for?

Witnessed that myself

I wrote the Bernie comment above. For the record, my son plays for BLC. I know, I know "not an elite club, nobody cares....blah blah blah." Not a holdback fwiw. The holdback debate is too daft for words and this thread has been taken over by insecure parents who spend too much time worrying about other peoples' kids. You can complain as much as you want, but the system will not change. If you are that concerned -- and that much of an lacrosse expert on the problems associated with holdbacks -- maybe you should start a club that only has your definition of on-age boys....or maybe try another sport that your ginger egos can handle. Otherwise you are wasting your time and ruining your kids' lives as you brow beat them on the drive back to the burbs of burbs of Annapolis after you lost.

You don’t understand the difference between cheating and not cheating. You are just as much as the problem as anyone else.

I've played for over 30 years (still play) and have coached almost as long. I've forgotten more than you'll ever "understand" about the sport.

This forum is not some roundtable of people in charge of lax rules and who defines "cheating." Yawn.

You know nothing.

You insinuate holdbacks are cheating. It’s not. Scram.

If your 7th grader repeats 7th grade in school that is considered a holdback. If that kid then moves from the '27 team to the '28 team to play 7th grade again this is within the rules. NOT CHEATING.

If your current 8th grader moves from the '27 team to the '28 team to play 7th grade again because he intends to holdback at some point in the future this is against the rules. THIS IS CHEATING.

Not a fan of holdbacks but it is within the rules and is very common amongst most top teams. The kids just choosing to play down on a younger grade team is cheating and there is no defense for it. We need to distinguish between these 2 scenarios. The programs cheating in the second scenario should be called out and embarrassed.

A lot of NY kids used to do that a lot - with the caveat that “oh I’m doing a PG in like 5 years so I’ll play down.”

There are rules in most tournaments the explicitly forbid this for that reason.

It’s was their counterbalance to the holdback phenomenon in the mid Atlantic. I “guess” its understandable in theory but it’s cheating none the less.

Hit the wall.

Your 1st example, it’s not cheating according to the rules, but I’d be embarrassed if my kid did that. My dad would have been embarrassed if I did that 40 years ago too. The kids we were impressed with years ago were the kids who played up. Not vice versa. If a kid is held back for academic reasons, social reasons, etc. That’s fine, but that shouldn’t translate to youth lacrosse. Lots of kids like my son play football too. So are you supposed to play on age with one sport, play down with the other? It’s youth sports, play your age.

Simple fix…..it’s called birth year.

I didn't insinuate anything. Obviously my story about parents lying about their kids' age hit too close to home. Go Hawks 2027, I mean 2028.

One National team, we'll call them TNB, is well versed on the script. Get used to this answer this summer 2028 families. When asked, the parents respond automatically "he just turned 13 in June." But the kids aren't so automatic when responding to other kids. This team had at least five 15 year olds. These kids aren't holdbacks or double holdbacks or whatever you want to call them. These are players who are older and in a class higher than the rules of the tournament. Remember, the Crabs posted pictures of their 2026's playing on the 2027 Sand Storm team this year.

Exactly.
Got to love the holdback parents justification as to what's cheating and whets not cheating. If you play your older kid against younger kids for an advantage - your a cheat. Doesn't matter what the rules loophole is.
Save that Laxxt for HS where age doesn't matter.

The hold back parents have all these sayings...Chop wood, carry water, lunch pail kid, blue collar mentality.... these parents are full of Laxxt. They don't want their kids playing on age with blue collar kids.

When asked, the parents respond automatically "he just turned 13 in June."

That is funny. I heard this all summer.

Well, they still [Censored] even with 8th graders on their team.

"National Team Dad" here again. My son has been playing against "heldback for lax" kids since at least 4th grade if not 3rd when he started club ball. He attends an MIAA school and it is what it is. I don't even intend to complain about it.

My stated point was that the "my son is going to reclass eventually" holdbacks are blatantly illegal.

My unstated point (or "insinuation") was that if holdbacks are no big deal, why do so many parents in our orbit feel compelled to lie about it, or hide their son's birthday away from other kids and parents outside their immediate circle? How many times do I have to see birthdays on the team roster and then have the parents tell me entirely different dates? That's a lot of effort to obscure the truth if holding back Braydenn is "just to make sure he's as competitive as possible." And isn't really about what Mom and Dad get to tell their friends and clients at the country club.

My kids on age but just a question -

Why do you feel entitled to know? Why do you think it’s your business in the first place? You seem super invested in the specifics on other peoples children. Which is weird.

Holdbacks are a thing and aren’t breaking the rules.

I thought he made a pretty good point about the parents of holdbacks being scared of admitting/owning it despite claiming “it’s no big deal”. Cowards. Ashamed their progeny couldn’t validate their perception of their own DNA quality without a little cheating that nobody needs to notice or worry about.

Get out of here. We want to know who the cheaters are. That's why.

If you can afford to cheat (private school holdback) its legal. If you can't afford to cheat (on age public school) its illegal. Got it.

I don't feel entitled to anything.

But I'm a parent, a coach, and a former educator as well. The psychology of holdback apologists is very interesting to me in general.

Why not just own it since "holdbacks are a thing and aren't breaking the rules?" Why scrub social media mentions of kids' birthdays and lie to other parents about their age? Talk about super invested and weird....."the world can't know how old my kid is, we need other parents to think he's younger!" "Carsten, stop telling the other kids your age!!! SHhhhh!"

Weirder yet........telling your kids that they have to keep quiet about the fact that you believe they can only compete against little kids.

Want to hold kids back? Cool. Own it. "Yeah my kid is two years older, and so what, he's phenomenal compared to your kid."




I don't feel entitled to anything.

But I'm a parent, a coach, and a former educator as well. The psychology of holdback apologists is very interesting to me in general. And when a parent tells me in detail about their kid's age and how "surprisingly" big he is, and then an IG reel pops up saying, "TEENAGER NOW!!!!".....it is what it is. Then, mystically, the post disappears ha ha ha.

Why not just own it since "holdbacks are a thing and aren't breaking the rules?" Why scrub social media mentions of kids' birthdays and lie to other parents about their age? Talk about super invested and weird....."the world can't know how old my kid is, we need other parents to think he's younger!" "Carsten, stop telling the other kids your age!!! SHhhhh!"

Weirder yet........telling your kids that they have to keep quiet about the fact that you believe they can only compete against little kids.

Want to hold kids back? Cool. Own it. "Yeah my kid is two years older, and so what, he's phenomenal compared to your kid." "Graysson, you're 2 years older than those kids, take control of the game!"

☝🏻

Exactly.

I'm starting to think this is why no one care about professional lacrosse. The kids that grow up playing have such a bad experience with the youth club lacrosse shenanigan's that by the time they get out of school they detest it.

Look at MLS. Stadiums are completely packed. I never hear the soccer kids being obsessed with college or playing professionally. They have a great time playing, there's no cheating, and the fan base stays.

The youth soccer demographics are completely mixed both socio economically and racially.

If club lacrosse cared at all about the future of the sport, they would make things fair, go on age, and stop the sport from being run by the private school elitists.

Totally agree, if you're holding your kid back for sports reasons, just own it, since it's clearly not a big deal and isn't cheating. Personally I think it's a super weak move, and I'm not thrilled with the idea of kids who have gone through puberty going against my prepubescent kid and potentially seriously injuring him due to a major size disparity. But yeah, own your decision, guys.

Lol at the guy stalking kids Instagram pages look at birthday party posts?


Weirdos out here

What team do you coach?

What are you, over 40 years old or under 15? IG puts those feeds on your own page if you follow your kid.

Yup, a lot of weirdos sending their 14yr old sons to beat the heck out of 12 yr old's, just to brag to the other families at the country club about how much of a student their son is. SMH.
When the wacky libs complain about privilege this is the type of behavior they are spot on about.

As the father of a BLC player, I would assume you have developed quite an expertise on losing so I think this point is compelling.

Legacy is ready to make some noise down there this fall!!

Nice attempt at deflection

No.

You are a creep. IG will show you profiles similar to those you follow of course. The only way you know a kid posted a birthday party pic - and then deleted it is if you stalk though pages individually.

lost

NAL should be a great fall tournament as usual.