BOTC - US Lacrosse Community Forum Forums MID-ATLANTIC LACROSSE MARYLAND FORUM Girls 2027 Grads - Mid Atlantic Region

Disagree here. 26 class is much deeper than 27s. 27 have 3 teams in a class by themselves. For 26s, that number is closer to 5 or 6.

As someone with a daughter in both years, here is my perspective.

Heros Green 26s well ahead of M&D 27s at same age

M&D, Heros White 26s were pretty close to HG and BLC 27s.

But the big difference is that last year-- Pride, Stars, SW are massively ahead of where Coppermine, Pride, NEMS are.


I think the biggest difference in this class is that the top talent consolidated much earlier. Last year there was a lot of movement in the 26s over the summer. Heros White imploded, several key players from Pride went to Stars, SW picked up some good depth.


I actually expect much LESS movement in the 27s this summer as a result.

I think you are letting the one year of development mess with your observations.

2028s for example have 4-5 teams that can all compete then huge drop off. That doesn't mean that they are "better" at same point because 2027s have three teams above the rest.

I wouldn't put Coppermine or NEMS 27 into the the top-6 of age group either.

They didn't say 27's were deeper than 26's. They just said there are great players in the group.

You can only play the year in which your daughter is classified. But M&D (and also Hero's 27) had huge years.

M&D won almost every spring/summer tournament in 2021. How much better do you want them to be?

Don't be a hater.

Give Hero's and M&D their just due.

I Agree. The top 3 clubs are outstanding. Which is why i don't expect as much movement as normal.

I thought the question was about class depth, which is think the 27s are behind in. One of the reason the top 3 clubs had few competitive MD games before playoffs.

I suppose we could argue about M&D Black 27 vs. last year Hero's Green 26s. But that is the point of internet boards.

If M&D rolls EStix and Aces/MadS this weekend, then I think they can make the case for being an truly elite MD team.

I think it is about depth and I think 2027 have it. I can't speak to the 2026 class very well though.

Its kinda a catch 20 in some ways. If you wanna say there are only three dominant teams in 2027, fine, but those middle of the pack A teams are very very good. LBC did beat Hero's. NEMS did lose by just 1 to M&D. MDU did beat Aces in the fall and YJA in the summer.

So if those top 3 MD teams are elite, then by evidence of game scores, those middle of the pack are really good. Is it the same way at 2026?

I think people are always looking for comparisons. But it's subjective when trying to compare different age groups.

Knowing both Hero's 26 and M&D 27 very well, I can tell you they are both outstanding in their own ways. Whether one is better than the other is fun conversation. But at the end of the day, they should both be proud of what they have built.

Neither team is perfect. They both lose every once in a while. Which is probably healthy.

I'm glad they are from different organizations. It's good to see high level talent in our area.

Good luck to both this summer.

This is going to come off as hating on M&D, obviously they continue to have tremendous success at all age levels. How much of their success is related to having "holdbacks"? Is this a legit thing or nonsense? I see the photos from these games and its obvious in some of them that M&D has kids just physically bigger. Size and age matters alot, especially pre HS levels. I mean in one photo from championships this weekend, the M&D draw girl is a going against a kid who barely comes up to her shoulders?

Anyone on M&D can clarify? Maybe these kids are just big for age.

Obviously you aren't familiar with most of the upper level teams in 27. And that draw girl might be the youngest on that team.

Wait until you see Eagle Stix

This isn't boys lacrosse. Hold backs aren't a thing in our area for girls lacrosse.

No holdbacks that I am aware of. Also M and D isn’t that big. We give up sIze when we play eagle stix, Yellow Jackets and a couple others.

I guess I wasn’t clear, I am not referring to 2027 in general, tbh age gap pretty slim at this point for real advantage. I’m referring to all ages but younger where one age difference is huge.

I can’t speak specifically to the 27 team but most of the older groups have had or still have multiple holdbacks including the 23,24,25, and 26’s for m&d. Other teams like heros and skywalkers have them too but traditionally m&d has more as they are a feeder from/for McDonogh where they push the best talent to take pre 1st.

Oh and it’s ridiculous.

So, you're saying that they're identifying the "best talent" in kindergarten at McDonough and push them to take pre-first? That seems incorrect. More likely, it's common for McDonough kids to take pre-first (for a variety of reasons) and it's also common for McDonough kids to play at M&D.

Whoever is evaluating the talent at Mcdonogh and holding them back should take their talent to pro sports. They could make a lot of money.

holdbacks are real....hence why some teams won't play in tournaments that are age restricted. Nationals....why don't M&D, Eagle Stix and Mad skills go....13 under.

and yes....eagle Stix girl can buy a round for parents after the tourney

Yes, everyone with kids knows who the athletes are very early, not that others can’t develop but by pushing the initial athletes back a year it limits these other(younger) kids to develop. Great study done a few years ago regarding Canadian hockey and how months older made a difference. Ngll allows girls that could be almost 2 years older that some on the same team. It is the only sport In the country that allows this to happen. US lacrosse already changed their rules but Chris Robinson won’t change tournaments or Ngll because it benefits his organization, not the sport and certainly not the girls and for those who disagree, remember the simplest thing, these older girls have now taken a roster spot of someone who is the correct age.
It is simply working and needs to be fixed for safety and fairness.

Does the 2027 M&D team have any girls who are 14 already?

Simple question, wonder if it gets answered.

I watched a younger age championship Sunday where M&D had a draw girl easily a head above any other kid, they won all but one draw in that half.

How much does that contribute to their “championships”? How do they non holdback parents feel on that team seeing their kid get 2nd fiddle?

It’s not about the school evaluating lacrosse talent, it’s about giving parents the ability to give their kids up both academically and athletically by offering this work around of pre 1st. What parent doesn’t want to give their kid the best opportunity to succeed. The issue is that CR and NGLL allow and even promote it for m&d kids. So the kids who show an early like for athletics are given a distinct advantage over age appropriate kids. Again, great study on all this if you believe in science and research, just google relative age effect(RAE)

Rule should be age as of Sept 1, imo

No 14 yr Olds. Good try though..

why don't you accept teams are just good. Sorry yours isn't

What are you talking about CR and M&D promote this for their kids? No child plays for M&D in kindergarten so if kids take pre-first it's completely parent driven at that age. The McDonough/M&D overlap isn't nearly what it used to be in the past anyway. The issue of "holdbacks" is everywhere in lacrosse, it isn't driven by the NGLL and CR. Take a look at a the boys threads, it's all they ever talk about. Ultimately, some kids just grow faster than others, you have no idea what age most of these kids are, so stop with the conspiracy theories.

That's correct, we don't have any idea what age any of the kids are.

This is a rising 8th Grade thread..... IF you are worried about holdbacks at this point then start planning for Sally to play on the Freshman team (not even JV) a year and a half from now. In HS the girls will be 4-2 years older on Varsity. So if she and you are afraid but are looking a MCD or St Pauls or any real lax school, you may want to re think it as she wont be mentally strong enough to play.

None she’s not a holdback. Stop trying to make up excuses cause your kid ain’t good enough.

What about the 6th year and Covid holdbacks in college. Complain about this too.

You don't even know what M&D I am referring to, lol. Defensive much?

You will see holdbacks in the sense of repeating 8th grade and going private. Each M&D black team 26 and older has at least 1 holdback but usually it is a girl that was on red (or in the 26s case, hero's white) in the older age group. But it really isn't that wide spread compared to boys.

It s partially the parents and partially the academic institutions.

Many of the private elementary schools added a grade option between preschool and K to simply expand their “market base.”

It is sold as a way to allow your a child to mature academically, socially and athletically. And many parents see the benefits and do it.

But it’s mostly just a way to get parents who are willing, to pay tuition for one more year.

Many high schools that have middle schools recommend kids who transfer in from public schools during 8-9th grade to repeat their previous grade to get up to speed. The reality is it’s more so a way to ensure their consumer attends their school for 4-5 years, not just 3-4. Another year of a paying customer.

Do you mean because you are on the 27 thread?

"I watched a younger age championship Sunday where M&D had a draw girl " this part wasn't enough giveaway that I am not referring to the 2027 age specifically?

Agree its not as bad a boys, but 2-3 holdbacks can drastically change a game.

Then go to that thread and ask the question.

It happens and we all know it. There are kids on all level teams that it happens with… not the reason certain teams are better. The top teams just prioritize lacrosse first. Could lacrosse do something to change it- yes. Will they- no. It’s all about recruiting kids in the same graduation class.

17 former Skywalkers playing this weekend in ncaa final four

17!

Their older teams are / were awesome

The younger ones....not so much

Every Other sport figures it out, and it Absolutly makes a difference especially at the younger ages. Don’t think it doesn’t really matter or you are part of this problem of incentivizing cheating and stealing spots and coaching from appropriate aged kids.
I think it is hysterical that m&d wont(can’t) play in certain tournaments because it goes by us lax rules and not Chris Robinson’s rules
We all should be loud about this to Chris to change Ngll rules or the problem is just going to get worse

1 tournament. US nationals which only has like 8 teams anyway. Every team has 1-2 kids that can’t play. Not a whole team. Maybe in a couple years you can ask your high school to have grade level teams so your daughter can get play time too.

Will this change since CR sold M&D to 3STEP? Will he have less involvement next season?

It’s actually pretty typical that SW teams don’t get elite until 8th/9th grade

It’s hilarious that you’re acting like the issue with holdbacks is a direct result of the Robinsons when it’s pervasive in lax.. They are no where near the only team that potentially benefits from the age rules - get over it.