BOTC - US Lacrosse Community Forum Forums MID-ATLANTIC LACROSSE MARYLAND FORUM Boys 2028 Grads - Mid Atlantic Region

Quite of the year. “To make it fair” on the rest of us….

I respect these boys in a sport dominated by a non-Jewish/Israeli fanbase and playerś these boys showed up last year and came to play they deserve to play

WSYLax teams

Long Island- 91, express, Legacy/Rush, Rebels

Other Northeast - 2way (age?), Express North (age?), 3D NE, BBL, FCA, Sweetlax (age?), Freedom

Maryland - hawks (age?), Madlax (age?), NL (age?), FCA (age?),

I am good with any team that competes. Lacrosse has plenty of Jewish representation. Many D1 teams have them on the team as do youth. They are only 1% of population.

I am good with any team that competes. Lacrosse has plenty of Jewish representation. Many D1 teams have them on the team as do youth. They are only 1% of population.[/quote
True but not often do you see Goldman Goldberg Ginsburg I saw a goalie with the last name Dworkin he wore a Jewish star.

VLC dad: Both of those posts are accurate. That first tournament was played after I think four total practices as a team, but was brutal nonetheless. Not clear on why they picked that as the kick-off event. Not surprisingly the team got significantly better as the boys got to know each other and the coaches figured out who to play where and to some extent how much, but it is still very much a work in progress -- I wouldn't run away from elite if they asked, but I don't think it's the right fit at this point. There are also just too many kids on the team right now.

Similar to Predators playing Madlax five? times after three team practices ever, or whatever the particulars of their story are. Brilliant. When this is the case, you know the new club is being led by someone who knows nothing about developing young men in a club, year-round setting, given the level of competition in this area. They may be a great HS or college coach. Or a fantastic MS teacher or what have you. But for crying out loud, why would you do this to 11-year olds.

Given the fall disaster, if Preds stink in HoCo and this summer, there could be a mass exodus right off the bat.

If the Preds Coaches/Directors play the best kids on the roster they will compete. If they play all 25 kids even playing time it will be a disaster. Seems the same problem as VLC. Too many kids on 2028.

You’ve got to be kidding me. There’s not a single player on Preds 2028 that would crack the roster at ML, NL, or Hawks. Not one. These games were like 12-0 at the half, and then the coaches called off the dogs. Would have been 30-0.
The previous poster was correct— don’t put kids in such an impossible position to succeed, they’ll not only be discouraged, a lot of them will quit.

That said, VLC is not in the same boat as Preds. VLC was competitive by the end of the fall. Best some mid level teams and played Crabs tough. Again, it’s basically the old Cavalier team, which had moderate success in the Elite division

Game experience is what they got. Your attitude is why your son will be a D2 player tops. Play the best you can, see where you are and get better. Preds are on the move up the ladder.

Wish VLC the best and think they will be good at some point, but Cavs never played in HoCo Elite for 2028. They didn’t play in HoCo in third grade, there was no HocO in fourth, and in fifth they dropped out before they played a game as I recall. But VLC and Preds will be fine if the parents give it time and don’t expect to compete in elite right off the bat.

LMAO

I have a Question for BLC and NL parents I need to know if you guys see a lot of BLC Orange players move to NL Red after the sad BLC orange placement last spring

8======D

The fact that you think a parent's view on a single tournament will be determinative of anything shows how little you know about what it takes to be successful at sports long-term, though I realize this is probably because you have failed at life generally so you're hanging all of your hopes on little Johnny playing a second/third tier sport in college in hopes that somehow makes up for your many, many other shortcomings.

Yes, NL Red has a big contingent of former BLC Orange players and players that BLC Blue dropped after last year. Unfortunately none of the DMV b-teams at NL, BLC, or Madlax provide an experience like the better run b-teams like FCA White and it shows on the field. Too much disparity between the better players who are decent players but too small or not quite athletic enough to make the A teams and the middle and bottom of the rosters which are rec-level at best. No dog in this fight as my son doesn’t play for BLC Blue, but they have gotten a lot better this fall. So it’s hard for DMV players who aren’t good enough to play for BLC Blue to find a good experience. Wish we had some teams like FCA White in the sense of a quality and well coached b team.

FCA white and to a much lesser extent hawks black are the only B teams that are remotely worth playing for.

all the others, the kids would be better off somewhere else on a different programs A team.

yep i noticed that number 5 on NL Red was really good at cutting and most likely the best player on the team overall just low stamina and not super athletic FCA white parent

Fall results do matter. Kinda.
I think it's notIntelligent, but Fall results play a very large part to determine what HoCo division teams play in the spring.
And what others said about the benfit of playing elite teams for ranking points is accurate.
Many ranking are based off of the old lax power method. First teams are generally slotted, based on their past division, then once results come pouring in, teams become entrenched with a few wins (or losses) to those "Elite" teams. But those wins and losses are weighted- even early in the season. Before the true worth of an opponent is known. The ranking formula also doesn't allow teams to drop below (or above) certain thresholds if they are Elite, AAA, AA etc. Essentially you won't find the worst Elite team below the top 15%. AND you wont find the best B-level team above the top 50%. No matter who they play or what the results are.

Yes I noticed that number 10 the lsm was very accurate with his passing and when he takes faceoffś he was very aggressive and physical when he plays this kid had 5 goals against MDX and they gave him a shorty and he is an insane Fogo smoking the MDX fogo in the mid-Atlantic showcase

General question re what grouping a team plays in at HOCO. If the coach wants to enter a team in Elite (say BLC....for no specific reason...and not specific for elite per se) does HOCO take them in Elite or is there a discussion at admin level whether or not this is a good idea?

j

The way it works in HoCo is that each team signs up for a specific division. Assuming that a doable number sign up for a given division, teams play in what they sign up for. If there are imbalances in numbers for the different divisions, odd numbers, etc. then there is a “competition committee” that determines who should go in what division, subject to negotiation with the teams influenced. In practice, the established elite clubs always get into elite if they want to be there. So to take BLC for example — if they preference elite and that’s what they will likely do I think based on the tournaments they played in the fall, they will be in elite. It wouldn’t matter if someone had a better fall or whatever.

Given what happened in this age group last year. I don’t think they will try to force anyone into elite who doesn’t want to be there. So presumably the top 6 will all preference elite. Then BLC will as well. The only two other teams who are likely to preference elite are Kelly Post and/or Blue Claws. If only one of them does, then that will set elite at 8 and there will be no competition committee discussion. If both do, there will probably be a discussion as to whether either wants to drop down to AAA. If they both are adamant they want to stay in elite, the league will see if a nine team division is possible schedule wise and whether the other teams object to it. They’ve done nine team divisions a couple of times in the past so it is possible. But more likely either KP or BC would accept a spot in AAA rather than create an odd team league and the schedule issues that come with it.

So to answer the question because BLC is an established club that usually plays in elite in most age groups and played in elite last year, there is little to no chance they’d be asked to move out regardless of whether you think BC or KP are better. VLC probably won’t want to be in elite, but if they did preference it, then the likely outcome would be a 10 team elite division. Given the relationship of VLC to Crabs, no one would likely raise an objection to their inclusion if they wanted to be there. The big clubs never try to force each other out.

Appreciated. Very helpful

In the next 30 days the HoCo league maestros will have a difficult choice because of the ridiculous # of teams who insist on hanging out at the AAA level (15+). Either create a larger Elite bracket (8-12 teams) or create a B level from the current A teams and slide half of the AAA squads down to AA against their will, and slide all the AA teams down to A against their will.

It's an interesting conundrum.

AAA Teams who may or may not want to go to Elite, but would have to slide up:
BLC
VLC
Claws
KP AAA

AAA Teams that are just standard, good AAA teams that no one would argue
FCA White
Cannons
Forest Hill
HLC
Hawks Black MAYBE, but in danger of following in the next group.

AAA Teams that are kidding themselves and are likely to be slid into AA thanks to HoCo
DCE who was still open recruiting players in December
T91, whose only new players are from HoCo Pink (bottom of AAA) and Swarm (bottom of AA)
HoCo Pink aka Predators, who have yet to win a game against AAA or Elite teams

AA: Most teams except Sidewinders and Team MD should move to A.

A: Most teams except Baltimore Elite? should move to B. Maybe LTLC stays in A.

DCE has a 2028 team?

Can anyone here offer a historical perspective on the number of teams participating at the 2028 level? As in, whether this is a record number of teams (elite down to A) wanting to participate. Just curious about the health of local youth lacrosse—and youth sports generally—in the DMV/Baltimore area.

There is basically no chance they have a 6 team elite. It will be at least 8 including two or more of the teams you have in the first group. AAA will be the five teams you have in the second group. Plus whoever in the first group doesn’t play elite, and then adding in the third group until you get 10. They almost never do less than 8 or more than 10 in a division unless have a weird situation like last year with teams quitting like the Cavs. They’ll add a division if needed. The log jam at the AAA/AA dividing line is not unusual for the middle school teams and they figure it out.

There’s always more teams as you get towards middle school relative to elementary. Comparing sixth grade to previous sixth grade years numbers at HOCo likely to be pretty similar to the past. Maybe a few teams fewer than normal. The decline in numbers has occurred more at the rec level.

I've been tracking the issue for the last 3-4 years even before COVID (and coach two other sports) and I agree with this for 2027s and 2028s. 2029s and 2030s are weird. Very weird #s at tryouts, Crabs folding a team, T91 struggling to get numbers, no B Team for FCA, etc.

Some thoughts about 2028s:

1) The number of true elite players (basically, 1st line on the top 6-8 teams) is similar to past years of 6th grade. Very few will leave the sport by 9th grade.
2) The number of "good players" (2nd line Elite through AA starters) is similar to past years. Maybe a very slight decline. Few will leave the sport by 9th grade.

Those two things above mean that JV HS lacrosse will basically not be impacted at all........for the 2028s.

3) The number of "silent runner rec players" (A-ball club starters and rec kids we've all never seen play) seems very low from 2028 - 2030 vs the 2024-2027 group.
4) The number of "basic rec kids" is extremely low vs historical. Very small rosters including lots of kids who cannot catch and throw, poke check, or dodge without losing the ball. You have clubs like True Baltimore, Swarm, Zingoes etc who have actual decent teams at other age groups, putting kids on the field at HoCo A level who should NOT be playing competitive ball above B or C, if for no other reason than those kids don't like lax enough to practice outside of team practice, and the parents aren't prioritizing small group training (or clubs that offer it in-house).

Just a thought from a MS coach.

Are we really sure it is a top 6? True Annapolis had a couple of nice wins in HoCO last spring. But they lost to Blue Claws over the summer and this fall didn’t really play anyone among the top teams other than West Coast Stars and got shut out. I’d be curious to see a True game against BLC or Blue Claws.

FCA only has two teams at one age at the youth level. Saying they don’t have two teams at other ages is not indicative of anything.

What top teams has blue claws played this fall - or ever?

And the “MS” coach” is adorable in thinking the backups on the elite teams are in the same category as AA players.

Who do you coach?

I am not the MS coach who made the long post, but I do find it interesting you are offended.

Are you saying that your sixth grader is a back-up on an elite team, and you think that he is too good to be in the same category with AAA and AA players?

Serious popcorn conversation over here. Allow me to interrupt.

It does not take a genius or thousands of hours of watching kids go 1v1 to see that the Crabs, FCA, and Hawks helmets do not convey magical powers to kids that are otherwise "pretty good athletes" and who probably made the roster in 3rd grade and just haven't been rousted out (yet) in tryouts. In the case of Hawks kids, at least you know they are fast.

If I'm coaching Crabs and I've got 6 middies returning but 40 kids wanting those spots, those 40 new kids better be heads and shoulders better than my existing guys. Otherwise, I'm going with the devil I know (and the devil's parents). But that doesn't mean my #6 or #9 middie should feel like he is somehow better than those 40 kids who tried to get his spot.

If your kid's claim to fame (and apparently yours) is "barely didn't get cut again! because no new superstars came to tryouts!" then OK.

FCA 2028 has had two teams back to at least fourth grade if not third grade.
FCA 2029s are in fifth grade - one team
FCA 2030s are in fourth grade - one team.

Not indicative of anything? Maybe.

That's what he is saying, and it is Peak Fairfax/MoCo/Annapolis Lax Dad !

You just detest to see it lol.

I don’t get your point. At all youth ages from 2030 to 2026, the 28s are the only age with two teams.

looks like the AA dads are offended.

You guys are right - your Johnny is just as good as the elite kids. It’s just the man is keeping him down.


*Break*

There are probably 5 or so on each of the elite teams that don’t belong there on talent alone. That number might fluctuate from team to team but it’s probably about right.