BOTC - US Lacrosse Community Forum Forums NORTHEAST LACROSSE BOTC MAIN FORUM (LI, CT, WC) 2020-2021 Women's Division I, II & III College Lacrosse Season

[/quote]

Please explain how they support???? Ivies could have 100 varsity sports because The ivy student athletes PAY to play. The schools mentioned above provide athletic $ to SA’s. This goes to the discussion earlier in thread that the ivies will cancel their season in a nano second. That is where there is no support for SA’s that they recruited. And don’t be surprised when the ivies follow the Stanford business model and cut the certain sports that promote white/wealthy participation.[/quote]

You state:

“The schools mentioned above provide athletic $ to SA’s.”

Really, the school provides “athletic $” to the student athlete? No, they do not.

Do you think the school is paying money therefore they are “invested” in the athletes?

How do you think this works? Do you be believe that the team or the athletic department actually gives the student athlete $$$? Does the SA then pay the tuition, room and board with that “athletic money”?

Oh brother....[/quote]

Are you serious??? That might be the most uninformed statement here. Have you heard of athletic scholarship. Please try to be somewhat informed. Appears maybe your SA has not received athletic scholarship. How about some simple math. Tuition/room/board/additionals-subtract merit(if qualify)+athletic scholarship or financial = out of pocket $ to attend. Your uninformed misleading statement that athletic Dept gives $ to SA is juvenile and dense[/quote]

I believe the poster was being facetious or sarcastic.

This nonsense began when some Joker tried to make the point that Ivy league schools do not "invest" in their athletes / athletic programs. His / her point was that because the Ivy's do not offer athletic scholarships the schools do not care about their athletic programs. The point is ridiculous.

All this talk about Stanford, lacrosse is right up there with golf as a sport dominated by white & wealthy athletes.

What's your point? Nobody's denying it... but is it ok for Stanford or any school to use that specific criteria as a reason to cut it? ( and then lie and say it was financial reasons)

The point is, with all these calls for racial justice, lacrosse may become extinct at many schools. Not sure how you interpreted the statement to bring a question regarding it. Just a statement.

information coming soon

https://www.insidelacrosse.com/arti...eet-thursday-discuss-spring-sports/57011

Covid. Are you kidding. 99.96% survival. Most don’t have symptoms. US has 330 million people and 10 mil test positive and we shut down. Anyway, this has been argued already. Just found that reason too funny

Did I miss something? Didn't every school cancel their Spring and winter seasons last year? I guess none of those schools support there student athletes.

looks like Ivy's will cancel winter sports and as of now delay the start of spring sports. The assertion that it is because Ivy League schools are not "invested" in their Student Athletes is simply ignorant.

[/quote]

Provide data that supports your contention that more athletes at ivies receive financial support that is greater than the NCAA allotment.[/quote]

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

No data. However personal experience and the experience of family and friends. Ivy's have extremely aggressive financial aid. Especiallyfor families with multiple children attending college they can make it very affordable. Financial aid is not limited the way athletic scholarships are to "12" to be spit as the coach sees fit. There are other schools with excellent "Need Based" aid as well: Northwestern, Duke, Notre Dame, Georgetown etc... I know of Student Athletes who have given up their "Athletic Scholarship" due to the fact that they received more "need based" aid. In my daughters class more than half are receiving financial aid and it is not subject to or restricted by NCAA limits. Every Ivy and every class is different... but if you think that Yale, Penn, Princeton, Cornell and Brown (on the boys side) can do what they do with 100% of the kids being "pay to play" athletes or if Penn, Princeton and Dartmouth can be as competitive as they have been with all "Pay to Play" athletes (on the girls side) you are kidding yours.

Imagine if they could offer scholarship...

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

No data. However personal experience and the experience of family and friends. Ivy's have extremely aggressive financial aid. Especiallyfor families with multiple children attending college they can make it very affordable. Financial aid is not limited the way athletic scholarships are to "12" to be spit as the coach sees fit. There are other schools with excellent "Need Based" aid as well: Northwestern, Duke, Notre Dame, Georgetown etc... I know of Student Athletes who have given up their "Athletic Scholarship" due to the fact that they received more "need based" aid. In my daughters class more than half are receiving financial aid and it is not subject to or restricted by NCAA limits. Every Ivy and every class is different... but if you think that Yale, Penn, Princeton, Cornell and Brown (on the boys side) can do what they do with 100% of the kids being "pay to play" athletes or if Penn, Princeton and Dartmouth can be as competitive as they have been with all "Pay to Play" athletes (on the girls side) you are kidding yours.

Imagine if they could offer scholarship...[/quote]

My daughter receives 40k in aid to an Ivy. Was recruited to play lacrosse (we have an income of $250k). Was a better deal than most other schools were offering. Anyone who gets recruited to an Ivy and turns it down for a similar athletic scholarship (with the exception of Stanford, Duke, Hopkins) a is a fool!

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

No data. However personal experience and the experience of family and friends. Ivy's have extremely aggressive financial aid. Especiallyfor families with multiple children attending college they can make it very affordable. Financial aid is not limited the way athletic scholarships are to "12" to be spit as the coach sees fit. There are other schools with excellent "Need Based" aid as well: Northwestern, Duke, Notre Dame, Georgetown etc... I know of Student Athletes who have given up their "Athletic Scholarship" due to the fact that they received more "need based" aid. In my daughters class more than half are receiving financial aid and it is not subject to or restricted by NCAA limits. Every Ivy and every class is different... but if you think that Yale, Penn, Princeton, Cornell and Brown (on the boys side) can do what they do with 100% of the kids being "pay to play" athletes or if Penn, Princeton and Dartmouth can be as competitive as they have been with all "Pay to Play" athletes (on the girls side) you are kidding yours.

Imagine if they could offer scholarship...[/quote]

My daughter receives 40k in aid to an Ivy. Was recruited to play lacrosse (we have an income of $250k). Was a better deal than most other schools were offering. Anyone who gets recruited to an Ivy and turns it down for a similar athletic scholarship (with the exception of Stanford, Duke, Hopkins) a is a fool![/quote]

This has to be some fake post , there is no way anyone with half a brain would actually post this.

My daughter receives 40k in aid to an Ivy. Was recruited to play lacrosse (we have an income of $250k). Was a better deal than most other schools were offering. Anyone who gets recruited to an Ivy and turns it down for a similar athletic scholarship (with the exception of Stanford, Duke, Hopkins) a is a fool![/quote]

This has to be some fake post , there is no way anyone with half a brain would actually post this.[/quote]

Why would you say that? I did not write the Post but I see nothing wrong with it.

This has to be some fake post , there is no way anyone with half a brain would actually post this.[/quote]

Why would you say that? I did not write the Post but I see nothing wrong with it.[/quote]


Saying anyone who has a chance to go to an Ivy and does not is a fool is arrogant and ignorant. It's the exact reason why some choose not to go so they don't have to be around the spoiled little brats of these types of self-important losers. There are many excellent schools and depending on the area of interest there are many schools that exceed the Ivy league schools for that area of interest. There are many legitimate reasons for kids to select the schools they do.Possibly a young girl wants to chase their dreams and attend a school who has a legit chance at winning a national championship while studying to get a degree and attend an Ivy graduate program, is she a fool. Its the reason many dislike the Ivies as many are insufferably boring.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

No data. However personal experience and the experience of family and friends. Ivy's have extremely aggressive financial aid. Especiallyfor families with multiple children attending college they can make it very affordable. Financial aid is not limited the way athletic scholarships are to "12" to be spit as the coach sees fit. There are other schools with excellent "Need Based" aid as well: Northwestern, Duke, Notre Dame, Georgetown etc... I know of Student Athletes who have given up their "Athletic Scholarship" due to the fact that they received more "need based" aid. In my daughters class more than half are receiving financial aid and it is not subject to or restricted by NCAA limits. Every Ivy and every class is different... but if you think that Yale, Penn, Princeton, Cornell and Brown (on the boys side) can do what they do with 100% of the kids being "pay to play" athletes or if Penn, Princeton and Dartmouth can be as competitive as they have been with all "Pay to Play" athletes (on the girls side) you are kidding yours.

Imagine if they could offer scholarship...[/quote]

My daughter receives 40k in aid to an Ivy. Was recruited to play lacrosse (we have an income of $250k). Was a better deal than most other schools were offering. Anyone who gets recruited to an Ivy and turns it down for a similar athletic scholarship (with the exception of Stanford, Duke, Hopkins) a is a fool![/quote]


Sorry. Don’t believe that. Fake post.

Saying anyone who has a chance to go to an Ivy and does not is a fool is arrogant and ignorant. It's the exact reason why some choose not to go so they don't have to be around the spoiled little brats of these types of self-important losers. There are many excellent schools and depending on the area of interest there are many schools that exceed the Ivy league schools for that area of interest. There are many legitimate reasons for kids to select the schools they do.Possibly a young girl wants to chase their dreams and attend a school who has a legit chance at winning a national championship while studying to get a degree and attend an Ivy graduate program, is she a fool. Its the reason many dislike the Ivies as many are insufferably boring.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Wow! Angry, bitter and uniformed all in one post.

Your comment: "Possibly a young girl wants to chase their dreams and attend a school who has a legit chance at winning a national championship". Tells us all who the "Arrogant" one is.

Your comment: "spoiled little brats" tells us all who the lost is.

Your comment: "self important losers" tells us all just who is "insufferably boring".

You comment: about "attending an Ivy graduate program" tells us all that you are either a hypocrite or you are full of S#!%.

Some day when you are not telling your daughter to Go To Goal maybe you can tell us all what type of track record your daughters program has at placing players in Ivy League Graduate Programs as that would be useful information to the readers on this site.

Ironically because of my Ivy League education I knew you would not see the irony in my post.
That said when you call young women fools because they did not elect to take the path your little brat took it tells us all we need to know about you .

Ha good one. More like your no name 2 year community college education. Although the Biden/Harris sticker on your Prius looks nice as it’s helps you pose as an ivy snob. Now be quiet and put your mask on.

Now that's funny. 😃

My daughter receives 40k in aid to an Ivy. Was recruited to play lacrosse (we have an income of $250k). Was a better deal than most other schools were offering. Anyone who gets recruited to an Ivy and turns it down for a similar athletic scholarship (with the exception of Stanford, Duke, Hopkins) a is a fool![/quote]


Sorry. Don’t believe that. Fake post.[/quote]

The post about ivy cost is 100% correct. Almost exactly the same as ours. Believe it or not but it may get even better... they are also trying to match her up with a donor for an additional 10k. So much for your theory. Can you say ivy education and perks for state school price. I can!!

Sorry. Don’t believe that. Fake post.[/quote]

The post about ivy cost is 100% correct. Almost exactly the same as ours. Believe it or not but it may get even better... they are also trying to match her up with a donor for an additional 10k. So much for your theory. Can you say ivy education and perks for state school price. I can!![/quote]

Ha. So now we are up to $50k aid on a $250k income. Sure. That’s legit. Perks??! Uhhh. Getting your sports seasons cancelled.

Sorry. Don’t believe that. Fake post.[/quote]

The post about ivy cost is 100% correct. Almost exactly the same as ours. Believe it or not but it may get even better... they are also trying to match her up with a donor for an additional 10k. So much for your theory. Can you say ivy education and perks for state school price. I can!![/quote]

The average cost to attend after Aid, Acceptance Rate, Graduation Rate.... They appear to give a ton of $$$ they are obviously very competitive academically and they have extremely high graduation rates.

Princeton: Average cost after Aid = $9,749 - Acceptance 5% - Graduation Rate 98%

Harvard: Average cost after Aid = $15,561 - Acceptance 5% - Graduation Rate 97%

Yale: Average cost after Aid = $18,770 - Acceptance 6% - Graduation Rate 96%

Columbia: Average cost after Aid = $22,637 - Acceptance - 6% Graduation Rate 95%

Penn: Average cost after Aid = $25,033 - Acceptance 8% - Graduation Rate 95%

Cornell: Average cost after Aid = $30,494 - Acceptance 11% - Graduation Rate 94%

Dartmouth: Average cost after Aid = $31,449 - Acceptance 9% - Graduation Rate 96%

Brown: Average cost after Aid = $31,685 - Acceptance 8% - Graduation Rate 96%

If a student athlete has the grades and is recruited by an Ivy they are certainly worth considering...

Excellent education, competitive athletics and apparently somewhat affordable.

Will there be a 2021 season? What will it look like? Will there be out of conference games? Will there be overnight travel? Will there be a post season?

There are 10 programs that have been ranked in the Top 20 in the final poll in each of the past 5 seasons (excluding 2020) 2015 - 2019. (Probably the same programs going back 10 years)...

Maryland
North Carolina
Boston College
Northwestern
Syracuse
Princeton
Penn
Virginia
Stony Brook
Florida

What programs are on the rise and ready to consistently be ranked among the best year in and year out?

Norte Dame, JMU and Penn State have finished in the Top 20 in four of the past 5 years. Obviously JMU won a National Championship and PSU went to two final fours in that time period.

Will we see more parity in the future? What programs will challenge each and every year?

Loyola has a very good program, Richmond has been on the rise and some of the programs out west have had some very competitive teams.

What the Navy Coach has been able to accomplish is very impressive. Not sure that Navy will be able to be a Top 10 - 20 Program every year but what they have done is amazing. Dartmouth has impressed me in recent years, Michigan has everything they need to break into that group and I believe that Duke will work there way back into the top tier.

What has Navy accomplished other than an occasional upset win ? Dartmouth had a very good coach who left . Duke will be below average in the ACC for the foreseeable future . Michigan has a chance .

The NCAA announced well in advance of Fall and Winter season start that players would get another year. Why aren’t they doing the same for Spring sports? It is becoming pretty obvious BEST case it will only be a conference schedule with up tick of virus. This will at least give the kids a chance to make an educated decision on if they will get another year. If not, , do they opt out of this year knowing it will be hit or miss, so don’t use the year of eligibility.

NCAA needs to make a call one way or the other to give clarity.

Navy made it to the Final Four (the first DI Final Four for any women’s team from a service academy) Navy was a relatively new program in 2017 when the did it, they went to the final 8 in 2018. There are a lot of programs that have been around a lot longer who have not accomplished as much.

The NCAA will most likely hold to the 5 to play 4 rule. It is very unlikely that they will continue to grant additional years of eligibility. Students athletes who were enrolled last spring were granted an additional year so if they op out of school this year (the year) it still counts as one of the five years. It the player was a freshman last year and they opt out this year they will have 3 years of eligibility left.

Yes, Navy has done a fantastic job. Dartmouth should compete with Princeton and Penn for The Top spot in the Ivy. No reason Duke can't get back to where they were, with the exception of the past few years they were constantly a Top 20 if not Top 10 Program. Lets see if Michigan can continue to build, they are in a very good position to do so.

I just looked at Inside Lacrosse Top 50 incoming freshmen rankings / list... it looks like 38 of the 50 or 76% are at the 13 schools listed above. The formula seems to be... the top programs bring in the majority of the top players and they remain the top programs year after year...

Or the ranking were done after the girls committed and it's just a self-fulfilling prophecy...

Which came first? The chicken or the egg?

The reality is that those programs consistently bring in the best talent that is why they are consistently considered among the best programs. Coaching will only get a team so far, need to have talent as well. The talent pool has expanded but not by much, the programs listed (especially MD, UNC) still bring in the majority of the best players.

Or, people who understand the game tend to identify many of the same players as being in the top tier.

So sat watching many replays of final fours this weekend. Can someone tell me why the IWCLA has not recommended replay in college women’s lacrosse? There are some very easy calls that are just missed. In goal circle and one I couldn’t believe on a stick check in a semi game. Also after watching the games from years past why is it the same refs every year on final four games. I am sure they must grade out as best.

I know the game is hard to see everything for refs so we should help them.All other non revenue sports have replay in college.

Just wondering if someone knew the reason.

Seriously? take a second and think of all the things you need to do to provide the refs on the field with instant replay in a timely fashion. you cant just do the final four games this would need to be part of every team, every game all season long..

Yeah seriously. Put it in D1 first. Almost ever game is streamed. Again replay is in every other NCAA sport that is a NON REVENUE-Baseball, softball, volleyball, soccer, field hockey, so why not lacrosse. It makes no sense not to have it.

If they can’t see off the streamed version then don’t over turn it. But put it in the game so when it matters they have it. There was a blatant crease call in one game for example.

There are things that refs don’t see based on angles etc..not fault of theirs. So like other sports it would be a nice aid
To get it right. There has to be a reason that they don’t have this, but pass every other meaningless things.

I call BS on other sports having instant reply all ready in place.. there is no way that someone is working the instant reply machine in Womens Field Hockey.

I get your point it would be great if they could do it, but there is not the budget, the availability of technology, equipment or referees to make it happen.

College field hockey actually has something called a video referral. The players can call for a review if they disagree with a call.

You can BS if you want. But first do you research. There is review in NCAA field hockey, softball, baseball, volleyball.

Watch the BIG Ten or ACC network for these sports. Why do you think i was asking the question-this is where I saw it.

So the technology is there for games. And most importantly it will be there for playoffs where it is needed most.

I think there may be a bigger reason the IWCLA is not asking for this to be added as other sports already have it in place.