BOTC - US Lacrosse Community Forum Forums NORTHEAST LACROSSE BOTC MAIN FORUM (LI, CT, WC) Age and Reclassification. The good the bad the ugly!

It’s within 1 year. What don’t you get? Have someone explain this to you. Whatever date is picked, there will be a 364 day window. That’s goes for every sport. I could care less what the cutoff date is. You play your age. My son is April. Make cutoff May 1. My son would be the youngest by less than a year. Guess what. Too bad. He isn’t going through youth sports playing with younger kids. If he goes through youth sports being an average, that’s life. Sorry holdback dad, you are wrong.

Okay, May 1 it is. All those February, March, and April LI parents in favor, say "aye." Good luck, it's not that easy regardless of what date you use.

The topic is holding back kids. The topic isn’t a cutoff date. It’s seems like you are unable to understand this. Again, not cutoff date. Holding kids back to play youth sports. Nothing more to say on this.

Cheating at youth is ridiculous. I know at least a half dozen kids that heldback in PAL and played on combo teams. Some kids quit or don't get to play because they think they stink. Tommy you don't stink Johnnie is 2 and a half years older than you thats why he is a 4th grade Myles Jones.

So true. Now that holdback dad will come on here again and start talking about cutoff dates again for the 5th time.

"Great, I propose 8/1. You propose 9/1 and others propose 1/1. Glad we're all in agreement. Sorry Charlie."

You are right, I stand corrected. NO FLEX. Calendar year. Sorry your old for the grade kid now has to play with kids his own age.

Two and a half years older ??? The vast majority of holdbacks are 3 to 9 months older. Stop making excuses for Tommy - maybe he just isn't good enough.

Several years ago, soccer made the switch to a January 1st cutoff. There was some initial moaning, but that quickly died down and everyone just adapted. It's refreshing to watch kids play against others their own age.

My son who is now in HS does know a few kids who re-classed. Some did late starts, some did it just before 8th and 9th grade. However in all cases I know of, these kids were not the tallest or biggest kids. They were not the ones people think are holdbacks.

Just not true. Soccer participation is down 4 years in a row and by about 700,000 over the last 4 years as reported by US Soccer Foundation and Aspen Institute.

Sorry for your old for the grade kid. Someone actually posted a statement like that. Who are these ridiculous people. There is a date in every single sport. It’s youth sports pal. Relax. You don’t want your son growing up playing with dolls. Stop holding him back. It’s ok. He will be ok.

Or maybe you're just trying to justify why Tad needs to play up two years to be relevant. Having two kids that have played in college, the majority of the Tads ride pine because the others catch up. Yes they get recruited...not sure why, you'd think college coaches would be smarter than that. But those entitled parents have a great time being cheerleaders and drinking till they blackout at the games their kids dont even play in!

Comb team two grades. One kid early august repeats a grade plays vs late december young kid in lower ,grade dec 31 cut off. Tommy doesn't know this he is 5.

This is Tad, I dominated Tommy in PAL be cause I am on 3 different travel teams and I am so good that I played 3rd grade lacrosse twice just like I was in 3rd grade twice. It has made me twice as good.

There is no rational, logical, intelligent argument against kids playing youth sports with and against kids their own age. Sorry.

There is no argument at all. Holdback parents try so hard explaining there reasoning. It sounds comical.

My kid wants to play with classmates.
Answer. no, he will make new friends. Parents of kids in other sports have no choice. It’s age based.

My kid was academically/socially not ready at time kindergarten started, so we held him back.
Answer, I hope your son does well in life. No problem. However in youth sports, he still plays his age.

My family moved around a lot, needed to change schools. Had to redo 2nd grade.
Answer. Ok academically it’s more important, I hope he does well. I hope your new home is nice. However youth sports he plays his age.

My son has a birthday in July or August.
Answer. Sept 1st. That’s the cutoff date for this sport. That’s the way it goes. There has to be a date. Tell your son in 20 years to get his wife pregnant 8 months before cutoff date. This is the most ridiculous argument of them all.

My oldest sons birthday is in 2 weeks. APRIL. So he isn’t near cut off date. He plays with kids 8 months older. If I held him back according to cutoff date he would be 4 to 16 months older than everyone else. I’d be embarrassed being a dad on sideline watching my son do well against younger, smaller kids. They are little kids. It’s Youth sports If other dads had this way of thinking, this sport would be great. High school is different.

So if you repeated a grade and played on three travel teams shouldn't you be 6x as "good" as Tommy. Clearly you aren't that "good" if you are only "twice as good."

Not the parent of a holdback but dont you need to have a cutoff date in order to classify someone as a holdback. I think its ridiculous that lacrosse does not have age restrictions that continue thru high school travel tournaments as all other sorts have. Look on the girls side and IL keeps promoting the same high school holdbacks even writing about how these poor kids are going to miss their senior season of high school lax when none of them should even be in high school anymore.

So true....they’re always preaching how they want to “grow the game” phrase only pertains to the entitled spoiled cheaters. A shame! There will be “kids” on my sons college team last year who will be 26. Yikes!

I always find it hilarious when the announcers of the big holdback High School teams tell us how great this Senior is and that senior is. Well they should be, they should be College Freshman.

Boys Latin in MD a few years ago was one of the top teams in country. Every starter was a holdback except ONE ! Basically a College Freshman team .

I agree the soccer change was great and also eye opening. My kid got to play with kids in his grade/birthyear that he went to school with that he didn't before. His birthday was in June so he was use to playing with kids in the grade older before the cutoff change. My big takeaway from it was the kids that played UP had a much easier time while the kids that played down before found it harder playing against kids in their own birthyear/grade. Parents of the kids who were use to playing kids in the younger grade were constantly complaining about everything because their little superstar doesn't score 3 goals a game anymore. Its the coaches fault, other kids on the team don't pass, they are not playing the right position blah blah blah. The difference between the kids in the same birthyear isn't always 12 months. Its not like half the team was born on Jan 1 and the rest on Dec 1. Its usually a couple months. You can't tell me that holding back kids in youth sports isn't an unfair advantage because I saw what happened when kids got taken out of that in soccer and had to play against kids their own birth year. My takeaway was most of the kids who played up were much better off then the kids that played down when everything got evened out. Its funny how if you ask most kids around 9th grade if they would rather play up with Varsity vs stay down on JV most of them want to play up. I'm guessing most of the holdback's were put there by their crazy parents.

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This seems to be the most common thinking - except, when you actually go to the team's Teamsnap or whatever... the players all turn out to be 12-18 months older! It's really kind of embarrassing. That some parents hold multiple sons back... then try to rationalize why it was "better for the kid"

Nope, it is nice watching true competition of all top soccer players within a year of each other. Instead of the constant who is playing down in lacrosse. With lacrosse players within a two year range all the while acting like they are within a year. LOL..

Go to any top soccer tournament. No mention of holdbacks playing down, NONE. Go to any Top lacrosse tournament, The holdback parents are closed mouth while many look on in disgust.

Lacrosse will take soccer numbers any day. More than 3-4 times play soccer than lacrosse in youth and as they get to adult, it isnt even close. Soccer shot itself in foot a few years ago with many areas going to Club only ( higher cost). Resulting in many players not participating due to costs and travel. Sound familiar.

For the life of me, I have never understood why people care so much about age in youth sports. Just play whoever shows up... my kids played on older teams or in older divisions most of their youth lives- it never mattered. sometimes they didn't win a game but had fun. when they played on-age and there were older kids, they usually were just bigger and stronger but never very good. never did I feel anything other than sadness for the older kids having to play with younger ones and feeling what I presume to be inadequate

The reality is holdbacks are better, and remain better throughout their playing days. It’s factual and can be easily researched. No one wants to hear it, but it’s true.

My son is in his senior year at a public high school. Obviously he is bummed not playing this spring. I asked him ifhe ever plays vs. older kids. His response is yeah some are a year older. Granted my son isn't good enough to play in college but playing vs a kid a year older never bothered him but it bothered me. This year I realized if he's OK with it I should be too. Seems to be more of a private school thing where lacrosse is more important to parents than the kids.

Everyone knows that’s true. It’s simple logic. My 4th grade son is a good lacrosse player and a good soccer player. He is good, not great. Now if I tell my wife let’s hold him back a year,he will be great going against kids a year younger in lacrosse. She would think I’m crazy for suggesting something so notIntelligent, plus my son, who is a good student would be devastated. However as notIntelligent as that does sound, the fact is he would go from being a good 4th grade player, to next year being a great 4th grade player. At the end of the day, I also know this is so notIntelligent, so I wouldn’t even consider it. If he goes through his youth years being a good player and enjoys it, good for my son. If he becomes great, with practice, hard work and ability. Awesome. Kids who become great because mom and dad, decide to hold him back. Not so awesome. I’d use the word pathetic.

A great player is a great player regardless of age of his/her competition. Comparative analysis vs other players of lesser or greater talent is silly. The player plays because of how the sport makes him feel when playing and to identify with the culture of the activity. Feeling that you are a good at something helps, feeling that you are learning something and becoming better helps even more.

I totally agree with you. In the long run, parents do what they feel is best for their kid. I'll tell you what, the few parents on my kids H.S. team who held their kid back. once they get on their soap box I turn around and walk away.

Haha, that's a joke! Look at any D1 roster. They are loaded with holdbacks who don't play. Many of those kids were stars in HS because they had an age advantage. In college they are exposed for the bottom feeders that they (the parents) are. Granted there are some holdbacks that excel in college, but those kids would have been stars regardless of being heldback, for them, it's a shame their parents didn't believe in them. It's the ones whose parents thought they were gaming the system to get their kid recruited to sit on the pine that is revealing of the character of kid and parent. Karma! At least the kid can put on their resume that they were on the X lacrosse team!

When kids go to college. Many kids redshirt a year. In football as well. Kids sometimes go to prep school, then college. Doing this, if it works for your kid, God bless. It’s the youth parent holding their kid back. This is the part that’s the problem. Not college. YOUTH is YOUTH. Kids should be the same age. There is no logical argument to say different. None. Zero. These are the facts. Baseball, soccer, football, hockey, basketball all have this factual information and corrected this. This is the one and only team sport at the youth level that hasn’t.

Truth! I have not seen one legitimate argument for why lacrosse is so special that it has to be done by grade, not age.

It's all is a reflection on the parents. I can't see the reasoning for doing it. Ok, the kid gets to play for a D1 school. what happens after that? So often, lacrosse consumed the kids life 24/7 from a very young age. In addition, the child most likely was never told "No" in regards to anything. So after D1 lacrosse, then what? I guess, live off the fat of mom and dad...

My son is the youngest kid on a team with Holdbacks. He plays, a lot. The team is ranked in the top 10. I told him, go beat everyone and anyone on the field if you want to play. Work harder then the older kids and the younger ones your age won't be a problem. He worked harder then the older ones and earned his time. Now I feel blessed he gets to absorb the skills playing along side older kids. Has anyone complaining thought to use it as a motivator. But the horse has been beaten, dug up, re beat and reburied on this subject. I get venting, but this thread reads like a knitting circle wrote it

This thread has become boring to the point of being irrelevant. The non stop complaining about a kid who happens to be 6 or 9 months older then other kids being what justifies him being a superior player is dense and long in the tooth. My son plays basketball and lacrosse. He has kids who are young in both seasons who have or currently play-up in age and were/are top players. Likewise there are kids on these teams who are on grade but younger then others who are superior players. During the basketball season his team played against, and beat teams, that were a grade older then them. Why? The guys on his team, whether young or on grade, were better players then the other guys despite the other guys being older, a little bigger and stronger.

Likewise, when I was a kid I played both sandlot sports and organized sports. On the sand lot I played against guys 2 and 3 years older then me. Competing against these guys these guys “in no blood / no foul” games made me a much better player in organized sports despite me being a non “holdback” with an August birthday. During high school I was always one of the better players on the team, was a varsity basketball starter as a sophomore and team captain in my jr and sr years despite being way younger then the other guys on the team.

Sports, like in life, will see the cream rise. If your son or his team cannot hang against a team that has two or three kids 6 or 9 months older them him please accept the fact that your son or his team just are not as good as the other team. Constant blaming, crying or calling foul only demeans your son, his team and you. As the slogan goes - “Nobody cares, work harder!”

It’s funny how people embellish their posts. It’s not 6 to 9 months. That’s within a year. The cutoff date means kids are within a year. You wrote that novel, at least write facts. Holdbacks are sometimes 18 months to 30 months difference. I like watching my 8 year old play against kids the same age. Not getting his butt kicked by kids way older. Meaning 10 year olds. Just the same way I don’t want him playing kids 6 or 7. Same age doesn’t mean the same exact birthday, it means within the year. That’s the purpose of a cutoff date. Plus everyone who post on here talks about how their kids play up, kids are the youngest kids on the team. How is it possible, every single person that posts is the youngest kid. The point being made and it’s beaten to death, is I’d be incredibly embarrassed to play my kid down in youth sports. I’d be embarrassed to clap when he did well. I’d be embarrassed watching. It’s as embarrassing as watching your son getting into a fist fight with a girl. No need to twist my words around now. If I’m embarrassed by these things. My question is, how are others not embarrassed.,

Are you Michael Jordan? Clapping for you!!!!!!!

Bury your head in the sand, all those Canadians and Maryland kids are holdbacks, they’re also the dominant players in NCAA. Sorry Charlie, look at the facts, not your emotions.

What about the cheating losers who are 1-2 years older, plenty of them out there! Great in HS, disappear in college! Love seeing them riding the bench!

As Reagan used to say during debates, “well there you go again”. Talking about how folks should be embarrassed watching their team kick your eight year old son’s team’s but. Is every kid on the other team a “holdback”? No. Maybe one or two? Are the “holdbacks” 2 years older then your eight year old? No. Probably six to nine months older unless your son is a summer birthday. Fact is the other team is simply better. If your son is as good as you believe he is he in time will be part of the cream that rises. If the “holdback” is good simply because of his age, but he is slow and has no stick skills in time your son will surpass him. Until then “nobody cares, work harder”, or stop playing club against teams from other states and play ball only in you age controlled local leagues and tourneys.