BOTC - US Lacrosse Community Forum Forums NORTHEAST LACROSSE BOTC MAIN FORUM (LI, CT, WC) Girls 2021-11th Grade Fall 2019/Summer 2020

So what's the going rate for D1 Scholarships % wise?

Schools don't go slow. The coaches know the players that they want and they go after the players and let the player and parents know that they are offering a spot if the player wants it (if the player has legitimate interest they will discuss scholarship etc...) . When Coaches see the players they want commit to another school the coaches move down their list. Obviously most coaches have most of the same players ranked high so they are not out there offering spots to random players if the coach thinks they still have a chance at the player they really want.

There is no going rate. At the top programs the top recruit can receive a significant scholarship 75% and up. The number two may also receive a decent amount. From there it will drop down 20 - 30% and then less and none. There is no set formula but the top players will be offered a good deal.

Fully funded programs have 12 scholarships total. in theory that would give the coach 3 per year (not always the case due to several factors red-shirts, transfers, upperclassmen "earning" additional $$ etc...).

If the coach has 3 to divide between 9 incoming freshmen it might look something like this: (athletic money only)

# 1 gets 75%
# 2 gets 50%
# 3 gets 50%
# 4 gets 30%
# 5 gets 25%
# 6 gets 25%
# 7 gets 25%
# 8 gets 20%
# 9 gets 0%

The schools that offer you a spot gives you an idea of where you stand in relation to all recruits, what the school offers gives you an idea of where you stand in relation to other recruits at that school.

If a top tier recruit is willing to drop down in the tier of program the may very well receive significant $$. For example a player receiving scholarship offers from Northwestern, Boston College, North Carolina and Maryland would most likely receive more $$ from schools traditionally outside the top 20. The same holds true for academic $$ a student with 31 or 32 ACT all AP and Honors and a GPA in the high 90's might not get any academic $$ at Duke, ND, Northwestern etc... (don't think IVY's give academic $$) but that same student could receive a lot of merit based $$$ if they drop down a bit academically.

I agree with much of the above 2 statements and only want to add that many players that stay "in state" might not receive much athletic $ at all. That is helpful for a coach that might want to use additional scholarship funding for the out of state players they are recruiting.

And, how does it work for a public school? Are they giving percentages based on the in-state tuition rate, out-of-state tuition rate or does it depend on the school?

If you are in-state it is based on a percent of in-state tuition , if you are out of state it is based on a percent of out of state costs.

Was offered 25% for an out of State Big Ten Public School on everything - Tuition Room and Board,

Also offered a set $ for an in state school which equated to a 25%

The out of state offer doesn't even bring it down to in State.

Heard in PA they are trying to pass that In-State Tuition rates may be given to Student Athletes....

Thanks - that would be a pretty significant offer...

Well then the schools in PA would no longer be in the NCAA .

Why?

Essentially you would be giving all out of state athletes a scholarship without trying to count it as a scholarship giving the Pa schools an unfair advantage so the NCAA will not allow it .

I'm not familiar with the specific NCAA rules, but it seems unlikely this could be done for athletes only.

Some public universities have merit based programs that give in state tuition rates or generous merit money to attract out of state students. It's fairly automatic for those meeting the GPA and SAT/ACT criteria. My daughter considered offers from a couple of public university lacrosse program and was told she'd likely qualify for $10-$15k merit money in addition to athletic money, something she would qualify for whether or not she was an athlete.

I heard that the Yale men's team has made an effort to recruit strong players from less affluent areas and Yale is giving these players substantial need based financial aid. So the Ivy's give no athletic scholarships, but half of the Yale championship team is getting need based scholarships. On one hand that is great, but on the other it feels like they are really working the system.

Yale make an effort to recruit strong players.

LOL how dare they work the system giving spots to middle class kids instead of rich prep school kids whose parents can easily pay full price!!!

Here's how things work at ivy league schools. They have large endowments. Merit aid for every student is determined using a sliding scale based on parent income, other siblings in college, etc. Merit aid is available for family incomes well beyond what's considered low income. A family with an income of say $100k-120k can qualify for enough merit money for an ivy league to cost the same or less than a state public university. This is not secret information - anyone can run the numbers on each school's cost calculator. Families with incomes of $150k-$200k can qualify for merit aid at some ivies, but even with $30k in merit money a school like Yale still costs an additional $40k a year.

Ivies don't give athletic scholarships, which is a disadvantage to them recruiting non-wealthy kids, so I'd expect their coaches in every sport use the generous merit aid to their advantage. Just like public school coaches bring up merit money available to strong students, and other private schools mention merit money that can be available in addition to or instead of athletic money. I would not call that working the system, but I imagine the mediocre wealthy kid who isn't offered a spot because it goes to middle class kid who is a better player might see it that way.

Need at Yale is "Need Based" not "merit based".

Yes, correct, multitasking and misspoke. Ivy aid is all need based and they have cost calculators on their websites. Other privates do the same, but the income cutoff is generally lower. Some publics and privates (non-ivy) have merit aid that can be combined with athletic money.

Out of curiosity I just did my calculations at Yale.. I would get $22,500 in need based aid. We Live in NY metro area, I own a house with mortgage, 200K annual income with moderate savings..
No too bad.. now if only she could get in...

You would get more. Know a few people who have gone through the process. At 200k expect over 50%

Try it again but assume that you pay down your mortgage with most of your savings, and take out a HELOC so that you can quickly access money for emergencies. The richest schools generally don't look at how much equity you have in your house, and don't look at 401k's either. Last I checked, Harvard and Yale are actually stingy compared to other wealthy schools. Try it with Princeton, Columbia and Penn.

We’re getting 45k in aid at Penn on a $170k income. Makes like a state school tuition.

Just ran the numbers for Princeton. $300,000 adjusted gross income, $60,000 in savings, $20,000 in investments. I don't think Princeton looks at retirement savings 401K etc... and they do not look at equity in your home (primary residence).

With 3 kids in college it will cost you aprox: $20,000

With 2 kids in college it will cost you aprox: $28,000

With 1 kid in college it will cost you aprox: $50,000

The Bucknell Coach just stepped down, how does this effect commits?

This is not exclusive to ivies. Hopkins, Stanford and Northwestern and some others are very similar. In many cases you can get more in aid than you can receive from a lacrosse scholarship at those schools.

Maybe that’s the reason why he quit/fired. In addition to the losing record he flat out couldn’t recruit. My daughter got a call from him on day one and let’s just say he did a horrible job selling the program. Those recruits can go back on the road again or just stay (God knows why with this car crash) . Luckily for those girls it happened now and not in three months time.

This could affect commits. Publicly, the coach won't de-commit a player, however, if they do not like the player previously recruited, they will tell the athlete that it is not a good fit hinting and pretty much telling them to look elsewhere. I've experienced this with a few of my players but it is not always the case...

I think these schools are very generous with incomes under $100-$120k, but they are not equal to some ivies for higher incomes. With my oldest, our calculated need based aid for Harvard and Princeton was noticeably more than for Stanford ($160-$170k income). If I recall, we wouldn't have qualified for any need based aid at Duke. With my second child, the need based aid at these schools calculated to a lot more because they split the expected family contribution between all kids in college. So, if they determine your family can afford $50k for college and you have two kids in college, you get $25k more in need based aid than if just the one child in college.

One thing to be aware of is that if your income rises, you may not see much of it by the time you pay taxes and you family contribution for college goes up because need based aid will decline accordingly. On the flip side, if your income goes down then your need based aid will go up. A lot of kids won't have the grades, test scores and AP classes to get into these schools even as athletes, especially at some of the ivies, but it is worth looking into with an academic high achiever.

Why would they get more than what the school's cost calculator says? The amount of aid depends a lot on how many family members are in college. I don't think everyone qualifies for that much with $200k income.

Didn't know they committed anyone, figured most low level D1's are waiting. But if they did, those commits would have to wait for the new coach to be hired and see if that coach is honoring the commitment, and re-negotiate the athletic aide if any was offered.

Great points. I want to add that College Coaches will ask point blank to club coaches before and after Sept 1 can a family afford an Ivy and it does factor in if they extend a spot on their lacrosse teams and at what level on the academic scale.

Not accurate at all. In fact, a family that can't afford an Ivy is the best candidate for an Ivy if they are a stud athlete and an excellent student. As an earlier post indicated at Ivy's and places like Northwestern many student athletes will get more $$$ in need based aid than they will in Athletic scholarship $$$.

This is true. My kid who is a great player, and even better student focused on the Ivies specially for the reason that our income was under 200k. We knew that the need based aid would be equivalent to a 60% scholarship. Ivies are the way to go if your income is under 200k or over a million . In between that, it gets tough.

Hope that the new coach honors the commits. Is the program fully funded? Bucknell is a program that should be better.

Agreed if we all lived in the same area with the same cost of living. 200k in the northeast is very different than in North Dakota.

What are your thoughts about the D1 process. Think they are done? A bunch of camps left. moneymakers? or real deal?

Top D1 schools mostly done. Mid and low D1 still going.

Under the current set of rules, does anyone think that there will be poaching or decommitting in the 2021 class? Some schools, like Stanford, moved very fast in taking top talent while some top programs still have a spot or two left to fill. What prevents a school from reaching out to a commit elsewhere with an offer. It happens on the boy's teams all the time. In the rush to get girls committed, and for girls to get a spot, I assume some hasty decisions were made.

Why did the coach step down? Have they hired a new coach?

At this point most of the D1 Money is gone in respect to getting new offers from this point on. Scholarship offers have either been accepted, or are still awaiting answers. Only spots left now are just that, spots, with no money on teams. That being said, some very good teams still have open spots, and if your daughter is interested in a school a winter clinic is not a bad idea. (I would have your daughter email/contact the coach to ask if they are done with their 2021 recruits or are they still recruiting the class prior to registering, most coaches will be honest about this).