BOTC - US Lacrosse Community Forum Forums MID-ATLANTIC LACROSSE MARYLAND FORUM Boys 2024 Grads - Mid Atlantic Region

Didn't realize that Team 91 player on Crush who is the #1 recruit in the junior class is a November B Day Re-Class....perhaps reclassifying a bit more prevalent on the Island than some might lead us to believe....

Crabs parent here. Let’s keep it real, as if that’s even remotely possible on this site. We were scheduled against Wolfpack in the NLF when 91 left. The tournament directors gave both teams the option of playing or not playing the game due to the heat. Same option they gave all teams in the lost bracket. Crabs coaches decided they wanted to play. Obviously 91 chose not to. Can’t say I blame them. Play a game in 95 degree heat that means nothing? For us, it would have been nice to get a shot at 91. For them, not much of a point to play the last game of the year with no shot at the T-shirt.

November reclass in LI would be on age in Maryland. Holding back players born in Sept, Oct, Nov, would be reclass in LI with a Dec 1 school start age. In MD it is the right age to start and be in school.

Unless you are the coach, you have no idea how many kids on the team are holdbacks. A ton of parents do late kindergarten - it's not just about kids repeating 8th grade at the "request" of a private school.

Bro you been living under a rock? Everyone knows that WP went to the WSYL with 100% of its team and no guest players. That’s your proof.

And if you have a close team, parents friend each other on social media. So when it’s a kids birthday, it is very well documented. So, yes, we know. Still zero holdbacks! Hard to believe, I’m sure, coming from a holdback parent of a team with 80% holdbacks. Yup. Beat you guys up badly with kids a year+ younger than your team. Yeah. Must be a tough pill to swallow.

And that's fine except 91 kid/parent continues to scream at you Crabs parent about how bad your team is and what a cheater you are. You are being insulted and defending a team who quit because they didn't have a chance at the title and they tell everyone else how great they are and how bad you are. Come on.

And that's fine except 91 kid/parent continues to scream at you Crabs parent about how bad your team is and what a cheater you are. You are being insulted and defending a team who quit because they didn't have a chance at the title and they tell everyone else how great they are and how bad you are. Come on.

Not affiliated with either team, but there have been plenty of teams at all grad levels that have bailed on lost bracket games in 95° heat. Sure you can call them quitters. But in a game that means nothing but a chest pound, at the rising 8th grade level, I’d rather not risk injury. lost brackets are the densest thing ever anyway.

And that's fine except 91 kid/parent continues to scream at you Crabs parent about how bad your team is and what a cheater you are. You are being insulted and defending a team who quit because they didn't have a chance at the title and they tell everyone else how great they are and how bad you are. Come on.

Get the F out of here Wolfpup parent (for some reason your guys think you are smart) . Again, all other teams stayed and played, in all the years I have been taking my kids to summer tournaments I have never heard of teams leaving early. My kids have won and lost and we stay until the last game is over, we might be all packed up with the engine running but just out of respect, sportsmanship and just being decent, you stay and play through it.

AND AGAIN 75% of the teams there were in the lost brackets and they ALL stayed and played.

You are obsessed. A team didn’t play in a lost bracket. SERIOUSLY?!!!!!! Nobody gives a LaxinItUp! Move on!

I haven’t heard any insults about the crabs from this guy. The only people he’s insulted are the holdback parents of which I am not. Holdbacks have ruined the game and we here in the mid-Atlantic know that better than anyone.

Full strength*:
WP = ALL their starters and "most" of their players present.
ML = ALL their starters and "most" of their players present PLUS the two DC Dogs players (both middies. one of them mentioned above).

When was the last time Hawks beat Madlax? 16 months ago? 7-8 head-to-head matchups ago? Who's the one player that they're dependent upon?

The big FO midi that played for the 2033 DC Dogs until last year. Take that kid away, and Hawks coast to straight wins every game vs Madlax.

When was the last time they (Hawks) beat 91 MD? 3rd grade I think.

The conversation is about the Hawks and Madlax. Understand? Too complicated for you? Repeat: Hawks beat Madlax without their 2023 DC Dogs player. Got it now?

How many 2023’s does Madlax have? I heard as many as three.

How many 2023’s does Madlax have? I heard as many as three.

How many 2023’s does Madlax have? I heard as many as three.

The conversation is about the Hawks and Madlax. Understand? Too complicated for you? Repeat: Hawks beat Madlax without their 2023 DC Dogs player. Got it now?

Lets see if I do, Hawks cant beat 91 ever and Hawks can't beat Madlax unless they are missing players. Got it Now !

Nope. Don’t got it. I think what you’re saying is, if Madlax uses players that aren’t on their team, and are a grade higher, then Madlax wins. Not sure how you rationalize any logic that includes cheating with players from a different team, and a higher grade. I don’t recognize such games as legit since that’s not the Madlax team and wont comment on it other than to say that’s plain cheating. Again, here’s what I’m saying. Madlax vs Hawks (all of ONLY THEIR players) is anybodies game. Can’t believe I actually have to qualify that statement with a disclaimer.

The big FO midi that played for the 2033 DC Dogs until last year. Take that kid away, and Hawks coast to straight wins every game vs Madlax.

When was the last time they (Hawks) beat 91 MD? 3rd grade I think.

The conversation is about the Hawks and Madlax. Understand? Too complicated for you? Repeat: Hawks beat Madlax without their 2023 DC Dogs player. Got it now?


Lets see if I do, Hawks cant beat 91 ever and Hawks can't beat Madlax unless they are missing players. Got it Now !

Nope. Don’t got it. I think what you’re saying is, if Madlax uses players that aren’t on their team, and are a grade higher, then Madlax wins. Not sure how you rationalize any logic that includes cheating with players from a different team, and a higher grade. I don’t recognize such games as legit since that’s not the Madlax team and wont comment on it other than to say that’s plain cheating. Again, here’s what I’m saying. Madlax vs Hawks (all of ONLY THEIR players) is anybodies game. Can’t believe I actually have to qualify that statement with a disclaimer.


I’ll even go you one more. Take the FO 2023 DC Dogs kid off Madlax, and they finish dead last in the HOCO. Anybody know if that boy is still a 2023 or did he reclassify? Heard he “might” reclass, so Madlax takes that as justification for putting him on their 2024 team. Quite sure that’s accurate. Can some one verify?

We know hold backs and reclasses exist in the BDMV lacrosse world, they exist across the vast majority, if not all, of the HoCo elite teams. Right or wrong it happens and is within the rules that BDMV teams play under. As far as I know no kid on the Madlax 2024 team is not in 8th grade this year, if someone is aware of a kid who is in 9th grade and is playing on that team happy to hear about it. In terms of the big FO kid everyone talks about, he is an 8th grader at an IAC school which means he graduates in 2024. Every kid on the HoCo roster where Madlax went undefeated and won the tournament is a 2024 graduate and was in 7th grade during the season (including big FO kid). I don't know how hard this is to grasp. There were some very close games in HoCo, as it should be, but to say this team is dependent on one player or that these kids were actually 9th graders playing on an 8th grade team is 100% false.

I also completely agree that that reclassing/holding back is getting out of hand but also remember that many of these kids were delayed entry/summer birthdays back in K. The reality is that as long as (1) there is no national governing body in lacrosse that has any power to regulate an age based system, (2) most (if not all other than the WSYL) major tournaments at the youth/high school level are grade based, (3) lacrosse in the BDMV is mainly a private school sport, and (4) college coaches don't care how old a kid is just his graduation year then this will continue to happen and likely accelerate. For those on age kids who are playing meaningful minutes at the elite level this likely doesn't have a huge impact as they are playing with older kids and holding their own and getting better. The kids who are hurt by this are the good/average kids at the youth level that are getting pushed down because of this and may not get the opportunities they might have had in an age based youth world. It also provides an incentive for people who may never have though about holding their kid back to think about it. As the parent of two on age kids I firmly believe that until high school kids should be playing in an age based world but for the reasons listed above don't think it will ever revert back. The reality is that as long as lacrosse can provide an opportunity to go to a top private high school and then potentially on to a top college then the incentives and rules of the sport are aligned to make holding back a rational decision for some families.

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Nope. Don’t got it. I think what you’re saying is, if Madlax uses players that aren’t on their team, and are a grade higher, then Madlax wins. Not sure how you rationalize any logic that includes cheating with players from a different team, and a higher grade. I don’t recognize such games as legit since that’s not the Madlax team and wont comment on it other than to say that’s plain cheating. Again, here’s what I’m saying. Madlax vs Hawks (all of ONLY THEIR players) is anybodies game. Can’t believe I actually have to qualify that statement with a disclaimer.

I’ll even go you one more. Take the FO 2023 DC Dogs kid off Madlax, and they finish dead last in the HOCO. Anybody know if that boy is still a 2023 or did he reclassify? Heard he “might” reclass, so Madlax takes that as justification for putting him on their 2024 team. Quite sure that’s accurate. Can some one verify?

I’ll even go you one more. Take the FO 2023 DC Dogs kid off Madlax, and they finish dead last in the HOCO. Anybody know if that boy is still a 2023 or did he reclassify? Heard he “might” reclass, so Madlax takes that as justification for putting him on their 2024 team. Quite sure that’s accurate. Can some one verify?

A couple of things,
1) No one is using 9th graders in HOCO (at least not before the summer, I saw that happen last year), so let stay away from that discussion for now. Everyone will be in 8th grade, which is the rule... plus next year your son will be playing against 10 and 11 graders who were held back, so stop whining, and get ready for the really big boys who have been working out for years

2) The kid that you all are referring to played for Madlax 2024 for years and only spent 1 year at the 2023 level with the DCDs so that he can be challenged. So no, he is not re-classing to 8th grade, he was in 7th last year, and 6th grade the year before. If you don't believe go and look at any old discussion for 1 or 2 years ago where you were talking about the "ML big Middie"

3) He won't be playing with ML against Hawks, as he plays with another team now, which will play against both teams

Incorrect. You say that “kids are not 1.5 to 2 years older to start.” “At most, it’s a year.” As you stated, due to the MD cut off date being 6 months earlier than NY. “Hence” you need to add 6 months to that 1 year number. So at minimum MD players are 1.5 years older than NY players. “Hence” math is not your strong suit, now is it? “Hence” more BS from this know nothing parent who doesn’t know a lacrosse stick from a broomstick. And let’s “hence” hope you don’t know when the birthdays of every child playing youth lacrosse, as you portray yourself because that’s just sick. I know it’s total BS like the rest of the garbage in your post, but just so you know, that’s not a good look for you. Question: When you and your MD brethren brag about “playing with the big boys” when the LI teams come to town, who exactly are the “big boys”? Your MD boys that play down 1.5 years or more, or the LI boys that are playing in the correct grade at the correct age, against boys that are far older. Always wondered about that. “Hence”.

Normally I try to be reasonable in my posts but since you decided to personally attack my post I will respond in kind. Complete idiocy and whining is not a great look for you. Also I have no idea and never said I know the birthdays of all or most of the kids, none of us do, but we can use our brains, knowledge of the birthdays we do know, and understanding of distribution of birthdays to come to some conclusions which is what you have done, but you have simply done it wrong.

Last time I checked the age cut off for "on age" youth lacrosse was September 1, the same as the cut off for Maryland public schools. New York in its infinite wisdom seems to have different ages for entry but most seem to be either Dec 1 or Dec 31, that is three to four months, not six months so wrong on point one. Now to get to your magic 1.5 - 2.0 years from the start every kid on a MD team would have to be born on Sep 1 and every kid on a LI team would have to have at a minimum a following year Dec birthday. Last time I checked in the US there is a roughly even distribution of birthdays which would mean on average it would be a 4 month difference. We know this is not completely accurate with delayed entry, holdbacks, etc. so let's assume that all kids in MD including holdbacks, delayed entry, etc average out to Sep 1 and all LI kids average out to Aug 31 of the following year that would be 1 year so wrong again even with ridiculously conservative assumptions. HENCE you are a stunad with absolutely no math or analytical skills. On average I would guess MD teams are 6-9 months older than LI teams. If you take a look at the entry ages on Sep 1 for high level Div I lacrosse programs kids are about 6 months older than what you would expect with roughly 70% of those kids with holdback or LI holdback birthdays. Whether you like it or not lacrosse at the highest level is played at ages that mirror MD lacrosse, not LI lacrosse.

And to reinforce the point that you are a know nothing parent who knows nothing about lacrosse, no one in MD ever talks about "playing with the big boys" as it relates to LI because no one down here cares about the LI teams any more. They have zero impact on our lacrosse. You apparently are a LI parent who longs for years past when LI was the only dominant force in lacrosse. Those days have past, wishing for a return to the days of yore is sad but at least it provides amusement for us in MD.