BOTC - US Lacrosse Community Forum Forums NORTHEAST LACROSSE BOTC MAIN FORUM (LI, CT, WC) 2016 Women's College Lacrosse Season

A lot of what he gets is kids who have been playing together at YJ since they were 10 years old, the team chemistry is already there, it isn't something that he has to develop. Most kids on other teams are just starting to play together in fall ball of freshman year and it will take a while to gel and learn each others tendencies and style of play. I think it's very valuable and shouldn't be underestimated.

The reinstitution of the 3-second rule as a major foul is going to hurt them. He plays an "illegal" zone. Now there will be consequences again. 30-something 3-second violations against Maryland last year. Under those rules, the 3-second call actually helped the D. Now it will be an 8-meter again. Thank God. Now if we could just get 6 girls at each end there could actually be some room to move.

You’re not suggesting that there is not enough room for 14 players Tom move around in a 60 x 40 yard field? Does those 2 extra players rally take up that much space?

It's not 14 in 60x40. It's 14 inside the 12 meter arc. That's how the game is played. And it's incredibly clogged up, particularly at the college level. With shooting space, it becomes even more problematic.

The fans are different.
Wow really I have been going to games for quite a few years and every team has their fan that is hard to take. It does not matter what school or club team everyone has one! It’s ok glad you chose or your daughter chose to go away to school

Actually, no it's not 14 in the 12 meter fan for the better teams if you pay attention. The better teams will spread out beyond the 12 leaving huge spaces between players. That makes it harder to double or run a backer D, it also leaves more room for cutters making slides more difficult.

Different poster here but you are completely wrong. You can spread your offense out all you want but the defense has no reason to go out and chase and can just sit with their heels on the 8. Your answer was condescending and just ignorant of what actually goes on, you can take your offense and spread out using the whole field while the better defenses such as SB pack it in with all 8 defenders ( yes 8 as the more active goalies are playing defense a lot) inside the 12 many of which are actually inside the 8 and as the shot clock winds down you can take your spread out players who can now just sit and watch the clock hit zero. So while realistically its not 14 in the 12 it is way too clogged .

Thanks for the defense of my post. I was holding back, but you stated it perfectly. With the 90 second clock and no penalty for 3 seconds last year, many defenses were playing tight zones. You could not just spread out and gain space. As stated, you would just be watching the shot clock run down. There are too many girls certainly given the rules the way they were last year. Going back to actually penalizing a team for defensive 3-seconds is a great step. I think taking two girls off the field would help a lot too. Would be a lot more fun to watch. Has anybody watched the NHL's 3v3 overtimes? Fun stuff. I'm not advocating anything radical, i don't think. The guys play w 6v6 at each end.

all defenders back in and keep their feet on the line especially now with the shot clock, they will always come to you. Stall is gone

There is one aspect of the girls game that they need to fix ASAP. Get rid of the draw, please. Do it to start the first half and second half. That's it, then let them start with possession after every goal scored.

Like basketball. Agreed. Boys should get rid of the faceoff too. The boys it's even worse. Can't stand the fact that a guys sole purpose is to take the faceoff and then get off the field. Girl's game isn't there yet, but might be soon.

But the high school rule now being applied to college (only 3 in midfield until possession) is at least a step in the right direction. No more giant scrums.

Why??

Because it has too much influence on the game for such an insignificant event.

I think the team with the best goalie will then be even more of an advantage than a team with the better draw girl is now .

so should hockey get rid of the face off after every goal because Basketball doesn't do it? Obviously it's not an insignificant event if it influences a game, seems pretty significant. A team down by three can quickly come back if they have a good draw girl. As far as the 60 x 40 field., no good offense is going to pack all there girls into the 12, thats only 14 yards from the goal line, and not enough room to work. counting the crease (3 meters) and room to work (at least another 3 meters) plus the girls at X (another 5 meters) if you square that up thats a 25X25 yard working area of a 40 X 60 yard field. not exactly packed into the 8 (10x10 yards) and still plenty of room to roam. Could fit another attacker and defender if you wanted to and still have room. with your Hockey reference to 3 v 3 being more exciting, A hockey rink is about the same size as the attacking zone below restraint line, and half of it isn't in use at any given time. That being said Hockey full strength is pretty energetic and thats 11 people in half the area on any attack play so your analogy makes no sense. But this is neither hockey nor Basketball so lets take Lacrosse as Lacrosse

Rowling closed last year

Also the draw is never done without an advantage to in most cases taller player. If they want to keep it why make players draw up. Make it interesting and let a player draw up, down or to the side. Be real interesting if you could do what you want, not always up.

Also the draw is never done without an advantage to in most cases taller player. If they want to keep it why make players draw up. Make it interesting and let a player draw up, down or to the side. Be real interesting if you could do what you want, not always up.

You really are clueless or just don’t watch college lax. No one said a good offense packs all of their girls inside the 12 but good defenses pack all of their girls inside the 12 and your offensive players outside the 12 or playing at x are no threat to score . Adding two more players just tells me you have absolutely no clue. As far as a team coming back down by 3 being easier if there is a draw , wrong again , without a draw the games are essentially a shooting gallery . Personally I like the draw as it’s a natural break in the action that allows for teams to gather themselves and adjust .

The shot clock was a GREAT change to the game. I think that off sides should be like the boys , make it a 30 sec. player down. I think the 8 meter shot with no players down low is a good move BUT STARTING WITHOUT A WHISTLE STILL IS NOT CLEAR AND IT SHOWS. No draw would be interesting and maybe could be tried in the fall. Love the shot clock!

Agree there should be a break in the game after a goal. They should get rid of the draw, but make midfielders go back the midfield as a restraining line, then blow whistle to restart play from behind the cage. It would give the team a chance to regroup, reset, whatever.

Hate the draw but it has become slightly less important because in the old days teams would win a draw and then play keep away. PAINFUL TO WATCH!

Dowling closed June 2016, all the players followed the coach to NYIT. They made the NCAA's their first year. Another good D2 school for the money is Queens College NY. Tuition is under 6,000 and they have a new coach who is motivated and recruiting many local players.

True. With shot clock it is not a straight 1 to 1 correlation any more between draw wins and game wins. This year's version of the college game is going to be by far the best brand of lacrosse ever seen in women's NCAA lax. Restraining line holds on the draw, penalty for 3-second, quick restarts, free movement, shot clock, counting goals when shooting space call is simultaneous. The game has come a long way in a few short years. Still some tweaks to make, but it will be great to watch.

I would bet that you never played lacrosse on any level. But to answer your question Yes I watch a ton of lacrosse games, not to mention the ones I have played in, or the ones I've coached

First I never said they should add 2 more players, just that the size of the attacking zone could easily accommodate two more players and still have plenty of room.

Second- If a team is down by 2 or more draws they could easily close the gap if they had a good draw girl. I have seen and taken part in many games where, when down, a team has won the draw/face off, scored in under 30 seconds, won another draw/ face-off and scored again in under a minuet. Without the draw even if you score quickly, the other team could run off 90 seconds before you see the ball again. late in a game that could be a killer for a team. If you had ever played in a game you would know this.

Third- If you don't think A girl is a threat from X you haven't watched many lacrosse games, Shannon Smith is one example of a girl that if and when teams had your mindset, she would attack from X and score at will. UMD attacks from X as a standard set against some team with the X player feeding cutters, with the option to attack and shoot if opportunity presents it's self

Fourth- If you think a girl outside the 12 can't score, than you are obviously only watching your daughters team. these days girls shots are getting stronger every year. Watch Nicole Levy from 'cuse if she has an open lane she could probably fire one in from the restraining line, Majorana was another one that could do it.

and lastly, most of the better teams keep a good spread of there offensive players, and with the girls being as athletic as they are these days coaches know they must respect that. thats why the only time you saw a team pack in the 12 was SB vs. UMD, and look how that turned out.

In closing, the only one showing how clueless they are,w7x is the Long Island house frau that probably never even played a competitive sport, let alone picked up a stick

Kelly Amonte Hiller named U19 National coach. Anyone ever heard of her??

You really are clueless or just don’t watch college lax. No one said a good offense packs all of their girls inside the 12 but good defenses pack all of their girls inside the 12 and your offensive players outside the 12 or playing at x are no threat to score . Adding two more players just tells me you have absolutely no clue. As far as a team coming back down by 3 being easier if there is a draw , wrong again , without a draw the games are essentially a shooting gallery . Personally I like the draw as it’s a natural break in the action that allows for teams to gather themselves and adjust .[/quote]I would bet that you never played lacrosse on any level. But to answer your question Yes I watch a ton of lacrosse games, not to mention the ones I have played in, or the ones I've coached

First I never said they should add 2 more players, just that the size of the attacking zone could easily accommodate two more players and still have plenty of room.

Second- If a team is down by 2 or more draws they could easily close the gap if they had a good draw girl. I have seen and taken part in many games where, when down, a team has won the draw/face off, scored in under 30 seconds, won another draw/ face-off and scored again in under a minuet. Without the draw even if you score quickly, the other team could run off 90 seconds before you see the ball again. late in a game that could be a killer for a team. If you had ever played in a game you would know this.

Third- If you don't think A girl is a threat from X you haven't watched many lacrosse games, Shannon Smith is one example of a girl that if and when teams had your mindset, she would attack from X and score at will. UMD attacks from X as a standard set against some team with the X player feeding cutters, with the option to attack and shoot if opportunity presents it's self

Fourth- If you think a girl outside the 12 can't score, than you are obviously only watching your daughters team. these days girls shots are getting stronger every year. Watch Nicole Levy from 'cuse if she has an open lane she could probably fire one in from the restraining line, Majorana was another one that could do it.

and lastly, most of the better teams keep a good spread of there offensive players, and with the girls being as athletic as they are these days coaches know they must respect that. thats why the only time you saw a team pack in the 12 was SB vs. UMD, and look how that turned out.

In closing, the only one showing how clueless they are,w7x is the Long Island house frau that probably never even played a competitive sport, let alone picked up a stick[/quote]

Ok. You are responding to several different posters. I will take your points one at a time. I have major doubts that you played at a high level. But that aside...

1. The size of the attacking zone can not easily handle two more players. You keep trying to define the attacking zone by the area under the restraining line. That is not, practically speaking, the area where goals are scored from.

2. Don't disagree. Although a good ride would help.

3. Of course a girl is a threat from X. Don't think anyone was arguing that but if they were, u r correct.

4. This one is ridiculous. Girls do not score from outside the 12. Yes even Levy or Majorana. There are two reasons for that. One, despite how hard you think Levy's shot is, from outside the 12 it's still a joke. But probably more importantly, shooting space and dangerous propelling. You will not ever get a clear shot from outside the 12 and therefore it renders a shot from out there an impossibility. I dare you to scour the internet and find one. Get back to me in a few months when you haven't.

5. That is not the only time a team packed in the 12. Almost all defenses do. In fact the only time you will see defenses stretch well above the 12 is when they are down late and need the ball, or when they are face guarding a particular player.

You can keep trying, but you are not correct about this. The spacing in the men's game with only 6v6 is much better to watch. I happen to like the women's game more actually from a stylistic point of view, but the clogging of the 8 and all the shooting space stoppages and 3 second calls are frustrating to watch. Some of the new rules, like the new set up on 8 meters, and reinstating a major foul for 3-seconds will help.

Great Coach!
Was a very good player in college.

I would bet that you never played lacrosse on any level. But to answer your question Yes I watch a ton of lacrosse games, not to mention the ones I have played in, or the ones I've coached

First I never said they should add 2 more players, just that the size of the attacking zone could easily accommodate two more players and still have plenty of room.

Second- If a team is down by 2 or more draws they could easily close the gap if they had a good draw girl. I have seen and taken part in many games where, when down, a team has won the draw/face off, scored in under 30 seconds, won another draw/ face-off and scored again in under a minuet. Without the draw even if you score quickly, the other team could run off 90 seconds before you see the ball again. late in a game that could be a killer for a team. If you had ever played in a game you would know this.

Third- If you don't think A girl is a threat from X you haven't watched many lacrosse games, Shannon Smith is one example of a girl that if and when teams had your mindset, she would attack from X and score at will. UMD attacks from X as a standard set against some team with the X player feeding cutters, with the option to attack and shoot if opportunity presents it's self

Fourth- If you think a girl outside the 12 can't score, than you are obviously only watching your daughters team. these days girls shots are getting stronger every year. Watch Nicole Levy from 'cuse if she has an open lane she could probably fire one in from the restraining line, Majorana was another one that could do it.

and lastly, most of the better teams keep a good spread of there offensive players, and with the girls being as athletic as they are these days coaches know they must respect that. thats why the only time you saw a team pack in the 12 was SB vs. UMD, and look how that turned out.

In closing, the only one showing how clueless they are,w7x is the Long Island house frau that probably never even played a competitive sport, let alone picked up a stick[/quote]

Ok. You are responding to several different posters. I will take your points one at a time. I have major doubts that you played at a high level. But that aside...

1. The size of the attacking zone can not easily handle two more players. You keep trying to define the attacking zone by the area under the restraining line. That is not, practically speaking, the area where goals are scored from.

2. Don't disagree. Although a good ride would help.

3. Of course a girl is a threat from X. Don't think anyone was arguing that but if they were, u r correct.

4. This one is ridiculous. Girls do not score from outside the 12. Yes even Levy or Majorana. There are two reasons for that. One, despite how hard you think Levy's shot is, from outside the 12 it's still a joke. But probably more importantly, shooting space and dangerous propelling. You will not ever get a clear shot from outside the 12 and therefore it renders a shot from out there an impossibility. I dare you to scour the internet and find one. Get back to me in a few months when you haven't.

5. That is not the only time a team packed in the 12. Almost all defenses do. In fact the only time you will see defenses stretch well above the 12 is when they are down late and need the ball, or when they are face guarding a particular player.

You can keep trying, but you are not correct about this. The spacing in the men's game with only 6v6 is much better to watch. I happen to like the women's game more actually from a stylistic point of view, but the clogging of the 8 and all the shooting space stoppages and 3 second calls are frustrating to watch. Some of the new rules, like the new set up on 8 meters, and reinstating a major foul for 3-seconds will help.

[/quot

Shot clock is a double edge sword, use the stall rule that the mens game uses, little by little womens lax is realizing they should just play mens rules. the draw change this year is way over due, i like the 30 sec penalty for off sides as well, get the ball over the line and keep it in the box if refs call stall at some point. mens rules will all work very well in todays womens game

First no one said you said they should add 2 more players which just tells me your reading comprehension is non existent.
Second -If you watch games that have no draws there are many more goals scored in general and if your team rides well you can come back from a deficit much faster than in games with draws .No one cares what you have seen happen in a few games .The nonsense you are writing tells me the only lacrosse you have coached is at the youth level.
Third if you don’t get the fact that there is no reason to chase the player at x and many teams will defend that player at goal line extended or when they are directly behind stand at the top of the crease the very definition of being in the 8 .
Lastly the fact that you state the only time a team packed in the 12 was SB against UMD tells me you are completely ignorant.
Lastly the more you post the more obvious it is that you are not only clueless but even worse you actually think you know the sport .Why do you think they went back to 3 seconds being an 8 meter , because many teams were packing in their defenses you dope. Nicole Levy scoring from outside the 12 rarely if ever has happened and yes have watched her play in everyone of her collegiate games.

I think you are responding to the Kelly Amonte Hiller comment??

I think it was sarcasm. One of the greatest coaches and one of the greatest players. Canada ain't winning in 2019. Mark it down.

There's the kiss of death...

You had two "lastly " points . The only team that packed the 8 was Stony Brook. State any other gam that it happened in

Any word on injury to a Gator?

USC did it all year. especially against Florida!

Different poster here. If you honestly do not think many women's teams play with their "heels on the 8" you just have not been paying attention. Last year was the worst as the shot clock and no real penalty for 3 seconds both encouraged packing it in. I would have a harder time finding teams that did not pack into the critical scoring area .You are just wrong on this issue and believe the new rules will help some but playing 6 on 6 below the restraining lines does not sound like a bad idea.

The season is upon us. Who is overrated? Who will surprise?

Can Stony Brook live up to the hype?

It would be great to see SBU in the Final Four.

SBU will lose crushingly in the final 8 ... again. NU will surprise. They are preseason outside the top ten. They will not stay there. top 6 team this year. Might make final 4.

BC will disappoint if Kent redshirts. They are a good not great team without her.

Duke will be better than last year (they have to be, right?)

ND is on way down.

Michigan will not be great but will start showing strides under coach neilsen.

Florida will disappoint, again.

Maryland will not win championship this year. UNC might

Probable Final Four: Maryland, North Carolina, Stony Brook, Penn State

Best of the rest: Florida, Boston College, Northwestern, Princeton, Penn, USC, Navy, Syracuse

Would love to see someone else make the Final Four or at least the Elite Eight but not sure anyone else has the talent.

[quote=Anonymous]SBU will lose crushingly in the final 8 ... again. NU will surprise. They are preseason outside the top ten. They will not stay there. top 6 team this year. Might make final 4.

BC will disappoint if Kent redshirts. They are a good not great team without her.

Duke will be better than last year (they have to be, right?)

ND is on way down.

Michigan will not be great but will start showing strides under coach neilsen.

Florida will disappoint, again.

Maryland will not win championship this year. UNC might

Bold statement UNC might when the championship. Don't go too far out on that limb.