BOTC - US Lacrosse Community Forum Forums NORTHEAST LACROSSE BOTC MAIN FORUM (LI, CT, WC) Girls High School Lax

That's sad for the team.

I cannot imagine they are a good team...and I doubt you have a coach who actually played the game on a high level.

that seems to be common. unless you are in a lacrosse town, the less athletic kids wind up on defense in girls lacrosse.
boys seem to specialize almost from the beginning.

And let me guess...your HS team isn't that good.

Look at some recent Suffolk County champs... ESM, Mt. Sinai, WI. All had studs at D and M and Goalie... D wins championships...

Its only easy because they put the kids who could not cut it playing middy as defenders

You really are completely clueless, if any of the defenders on those teams were better middies than the actual middies they would have played midd. ESM best players for years have been the huffs and choma who all played middy and its the same with the other teams you have mentioned. Keep telling yourself that nonsense but in general your best athletes play middy , your best sticks play attack and the next best athletes are put on defense same as the order of recruiting , middies first, attack next then the defenders. There are exceptions but that's how it goes. Goalies are a different category all together.

Or...if any of the middies were better defenders than the actual defenders they would have played D. ESM's best players, whatever. I think you're going by press and defenders rarely get press. The fact is if your D sucks, you won't get far. ESM gets as far as they do because their D doesn't suck. You are stuck in a PAL mentality.

Actually, watching college lacrosse, I groan when the many middies come back on D because they just don't get it. Weak links. They are the ones who get beat on the regular because they don't know how to play the position, regardless of their speed or stick skills. An offensive player will just dodge or roll right around them and catch them flat-footed.

Middies are getting beat on D by their opponents middies.....AKA, their opponents best players. We get it, D is very important. But stop with the defenders are the most important position. The HS teams mentioned are very good at winning because they have more kids playing the game than other towns and they put the extra work in. Their defenders are their second middie line.....aka very good players but not as good as their middie starters.

This happens more than you think.

Exactly, they aren't winning because of their Attackers.

Your logic only works if you buy the premise that the middies are the best players. You can't build a valid argument on a false premise.

You and I, and whomever else is weighing in, are never going to agree on this. Never, never, never.

Or your kid can go to better colleges than Syracuse, Penn State, Florida and play D3 lacrosse and get out of college with a better education like Amherst, Bowdoin, MIT, etc and the list goes on.

i agree. Although I do like penn state lol. But there are great academic d3 schools where they can still enjoy playing the game. It's really crazy. And I fed right into it with my kid and now am second guessing it all.

We don't have to agree. We will let the best college coaches that recruited these kids first and IL mag settle it. Check out the positions.

2017 ILWomen Top 40 Young Gun Senior Rankings
1. Elizabeth Hillman | M | Bel Air (Md.) | North Carolina

2. Maddie Jenner | A/M | McDonogh (Md.) | Duke

3. Sarah Reznick | G | Long Beach (N.Y.) | Florida

4. Cassidy Weeks | M | Bayport-Blue Point (N.Y.) | Boston College

5. Erin Bakes | M | Ransom Everglades (Fla.) | USC

6. Hannah Mardiney | A | Notre Dame Prep (Md.) | Florida

7. Megan Carney | A | John Paul II (Texas) | Syracuse

8. Jennifer Medjid | A | Garden City (N.Y.) | Boston College

9. Julia Hoffman | A | McDonogh (Md.) | Maryland

10. Madison Rielly | A | Manhasset (N.Y.) | Maryland

11. Emma Jaques | M | Darien (Conn.) | Northwestern

12. Elle Hansen | M | Cohasset (Mass.) | Northwestern

13. Caitlyn Mossman | A | Notre Dame Prep (Md.) | Boston College

14. Sarah Cooper | D | Notre Dame Prep (Md.) | Syracuse

15. Anna Callahan | A/M | Glenelg (Md.) | Duke

16. Isabelle Scane | M | Cranbrook Kingswood (Mich.) | Northwestern

17. Darby Welsh | M | St. Paul’s School for Girls (Md.) | Maryland

18. Taylor Suplee | G | Southern (Md.) | Penn State

19. Tayler Warehime | M | Manchester Valley (Md.) | North Carolina

20. Courtney Weeks | M | Bayport-Blue Point (N.Y.) | Boston College

21. Chloe Johnson | M | Magruder (Md.) | Ohio State

22. Elizabeth Farnsworth | M | Hutchison School (Tenn.) | Virginia

23. Madison Mote | M | Bishop Ireton (Va.) | Notre Dame

24. Olivia Rubin | M | Bryn Mawr (Md.) | Duke

25. Lexi LeDoyen | A | Bishop Ireton (Va.) | Syracuse

26. Meaghan Tyrrell | A | Mount Sinai (N.Y.) | Syracuse

27. Madison Doucette | G | Unionville (Pa.) | Northwestern

28. Shannon Berry | M | Ward Melville (N.Y.) | Princeton

29. Brooklyn Neumen | M | Rockford (Mich.) | North Carolina

30. Katie Detwiler | M | Archbishop Carroll (Pa.) | Loyola

31. Lillie Kloak | M | Ridgewood (N.J.) | Virginia

32. Shay Clevenger | D | Marriotts Ridge (Md.) | Louisville

33. Jillian Wilson | M | Gerstell Academy (Md.) | Loyola

34. Julia Cooper | G | McDonogh (Md.) | Stanford

35. Emerson Cabrera | M | Northport (N.Y.) | Florida

36. Sophia LeRose | G | Torrey Pines (Calif.) | Duke

37. Kennedy Lynch | M | Garrison Forest (Md.) | Maryland

38. Helen Louise Johnson | M | Summit (N.J.) | Stanford

39. Marina Miller | M | Pine-Richland (Pa.) | Penn State

40. Maddie Ellis | M | Vero Beach (Fla.) | Florida

You can't use that list to support your argument, nor can you use the best coaches from the best programs ... The list is a joke and those coaches can not identify talent. My daughter is not on that list and none of those schools made offers but I know she is better than those players. None of those schools recruited her because of politics. She is a great player I called all of those coaches but they had to recruit other girls due to politics.

Parents tell their kids to switch to D to keep them on the field and on the team, most are settling because they don't have the tools, skill or speed to play mid or attack

And again, you build your premise on something that is subjective. I've been on here for years, those rankings come under fire year after year.

Thanks you just described the best athletes exactly and they play midfield

That's not nice to bring facts into the discussion .

That's not nice to bring facts into the discussion .

Whether the rankings r exact or not is not the point. The positions are. What you obviously don't know, is that many HS middies get moved to D in college. Why you may ask? Because the HS middies r the best all-around athletes and players at the high school level.

Yes, they come under fire year after year by the parents of players who are not recognized by Inside Lacrosse or by the coaches who are the best at identifying and recruiting the top talent.

You are foolish if you think the college coaches have anything to do with this list. And it's based on someone from IL watching random games over the summer.

unless you play at a top h.s. program or something other than a pay for play mediocre club team, why would you be recruited as a defense player? as prior poster pointed out, midfielders can convert to defense when needed at college level, girls who were changed the other way are stuck .they never developed offensively.

Some never develop defensively.

You are clueless if you think the position of Defender doesn't require tools, skill, or speed at top end HS and the college level. Take some time and watch these women in college play. Take your daughters to watch as well. You'll be surprised at the athleticism of the women defenders.

Yup. and most played middie in HS. Sorry.

yes. that is the point. some conference 3 defender or a conference 1 (A) middie with BOTH defensive and offensive game skills. assuming conf 3 or 4 player gets to play college at all a reach..... the best conferences (at least on long island) are 1, 2 and catholic league. their middies are most apt to possibly be recruited and play at some level in college ....

Yup, none were Attackers....no apologies necessary

No one said they were. what they were saying was that they are very often not HS defenders. Because the vast majority of HS defenders (yes w some exceptions) are NOT the best athletes on their teams. And yes college defenders at the highest level are very good athletes. Hence the fact that most of them played middie in HS. Once again making the point that HS defenders are often at that position because they are neither the best athletes on the team (middies r) nor the best sticks on the team (attackers r).

Not saying the rankings are perfect but know many of the girls on the list and they are very, very good players. Editor of ILWomen puts this together and puts a ton of time into it speaking with many college coaches, high school coaches, and club coaches and personally watched several times many of these girls and many who didn't make the list.

For the haters...the editor of ILWomen who personally puts together the recruiting rankings actually spends a lot of time during the course of the whole year talking to college coaches, club, and high school coaches about the girls. She also knows a ton about each of these girls individually which might surprise you and has seen many of them play several times. She was a former 4x All-American at Syracuse and is extremely well-connected with the top coaches and programs, she knows who can play and takes these lists very seriously. Not saying they are perfect or other girls shouldn't be ranked, just saying she knows what she is doing, is well-connected, and spends a lot of time on the rankings.

Haters going hate, just stop the jealous b.s. when you don't know what you are talking about.

I'm sure the IL editor put countless hours in on the list, ESPN and MSG Varsity as well - lol

Halley does the best she can. But there is no way for her to not rely on club coaches and HS coaches etc. as you say. And those coaches r inherently very biased. The lists are decent, as in all the girls are deserving of recognition for being good/great players. But there is no question that there are girls on the list not in the right spots and some girls left off that are better than some on there. It is the nature of these things.

Defenders are made up of middies who couldn't make it at the next level.

I get it, you're trying to provoke argument to continue this debate....

Or you obviously have no knowledge of the game of Women's Lax at the college level.

The Watch List was more of the same:

Maryland - 4
Notre Dame - 3
Princeton - 3
Duke - 3
UVA - 2
UNC - 2
Syracuse - 2

BC - 1

Stanford - 3
USC - 4

The best programs appear to be able to consistently get the majority of the best players.

I am sure there are many good players who were not recognized but I think the combination of IL and the best college coaches/recruiters must be pretty accurate when it come to identifying the top players.

If IL gets it wrong it's no big deal but these college coaches get it wrong it will be very obvious when they are no longer the top teams in the country. Until some other programs start doing better than the top teams I will agree with the rankings and the coaches of the best teams in the country.

Still about only 5 teams that have won it all over the last 30 years. The game needs other programs to step up and help grow the sport. The same teams year after year isn't good

Funny you say that.

On the watch listL

Notre Dame - 3
Duke - 3

Notre Dame and Duke, think they've been getting it wrong?