BOTC - US Lacrosse Community Forum Forums NORTHEAST LACROSSE BOTC MAIN FORUM (LI, CT, WC) Boys 2021 - 8th Grade Fall 2016/ Summer 2017

People are not going to answer that question. If it is answered how would you know if it were true? People know who the good teams are. If you feel the competition was good for ambush be happy and move on. Some may think the teams were weak some may think they are strong teams. No need for you to explain.

GC not an A team and nobody ever claimed they were. As noted above- kids playing with their friends and trying to get ready for HS ball. how many of your towns have been as successful over the years?? Club teams grab the best from all over- Town teams cant possibly compete so why try to make something over nothing?

Funny stuff. GC admits they are not an A team and they beat Ambush twice who claims to be an A team. The team Ambush lost to twice at Young Guns could not beat any of the other teams other than Ambush at Young Guns and lost by a lot to the others. Who knows. They both could be A teams or B teams. We will never know until they both enter top tournaments. The announcer on TV for the World Series yesterday put it best when talking about the Crabs who every year claim to be the best when he said the Crabs could never be considered the best until they play in the World Series and win. I hope Ambush plays in top tournaments next year and if they do they may just shut everyone up. Until then they should not be announcing victories against teams that most consider easy wins or even against good teams. It is rare that teams parents come on here and announce wins. When they do there are many negative reply's regardless of which team it is. One last thing. The Ambush team does have talent and are very well coached. They will get looks from colleges based on the organization they play for. It is too bad the parents put targets on the team when talking here. I doubt the negative posts come from "haters" or a parent of a kid that got cut or a former Ambush parent. Simply put, if announcements are made here of Ambush victories/championships expect negative feedback. Most don't like that that stuff.

Again, I'm an Ambush parent, and unless someone is lying to me, Ambush doesn't post the wins. We were laughing at the last tourney about how Blaze beating Black Ice would keep us off for a few weeks and were happy to just enjoy a week of no bashing.

First let me say my kid plays lacrosse for fun. There is no D1 scout knocking on my door. Junior plays on a glorified town team and enjoys it. I got an email from National 175 showcase. My only question is that the fee is $775. Is that fee for a team or one kid? Just wondering.

175 is usually around the 300 dollar mark. They have several events so I would guess it depends on which event you got a email for. They had one on Long Island in June and from what I heard the 2021 year did not generate much interest from coaches.

Wow Naptown, Blaze smoked Black Ice, but then was smoked themselves? Express out as well. Guess LI isn't too good in this age group!

Yeah it's a real mystery how true national all of a sudden is the best at most age levels. Must be something in the water out there

91 is a waste , anyone watching can the coaches are a disorganized mess.

yes, but the sideshow was priceless

So Long Island is not "too good" in this age group yet they had 3 teams in the quarter finals of Naptown. Had Icon been there, 4 LI teams would have made the quarters. Igloo and 9d1 were considered two of the top 5 teams in the country last year, yet 12 months later they aren't "too good". Hey genius, how many players on your son's team are in 8th grade for the second time? How many were born in the summer or fall of 2002. On LI, they would be rising sophomores. Or better yet, how many of your players are still 2020s and are planning on doing a post grad year so you feel it is ok for them to play down eh? How does a team from Illinois that didn't even win a B 2021 tournament on LI in the fall, make the finals of Naptown nine months later? Please tell. Enjoy your day. It won't last long.

Here is your answer as I was at Naptown and spoke with the parents of both finalist Eclipse and True National. You talk about bringing 2020s. Yes they both did. However both teams also had many 16 years olds that were 2019 kids. Some parents were against it. Both teams had only a couple of 14 year olds and mostly 15 and 16 year olds. Edge had 17 year olds playing in 2021. The finals are on tv today. It was win at all cost for the teams off lLong Island. Long Island teams made no changes and did not add older kids. So the two finalist played with 15 and 16 year olds agaist 13 and 14 year olds. The two older teams did the best. It is that simple.

Here is your answer as I was at Naptown and spoke with the parents of both finalist Eclipse and True National. You talk about bringing 2020s. Yes they both did. However both teams also had many 16 years olds that were 2019 kids. Some parents were against it. Both teams had only a couple of 14 year olds and mostly 15 and 16 year olds. Edge had 17 year olds playing in 2021. The finals are on tv today. It was win at all cost for the teams off lLong Island. Long Island teams made no changes and did not add older kids. So the two finalist played with 15 and 16 year olds agaist 13 and 14 year olds. The two older teams did the best. It is that simple.
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Completely right...

Is this even remotely able to be verified?


OBTW, red maverik helmet=2019 right?

how do you explain 3D Colorado beating 91 on 1st day. I'm sure they somehow cheated (apparently the only way a LI team loses)

Don't understand how lacrosse has not followed Hockey in using birth year instead of year you want your kid to graduate by holding them back. What a joke!

At the HS level, what would be the relevance of evaluating a bunch of 16 year olds by themselves, a bunch of 17 year olds by themselves, or a bunch of 18 year olds by themselves? The birth year, what is that doing for you, what is it that is so mesmerizing? Club at the HS level is for showcasing talent by graduating class, and in case you haven't heard, one graduating class graduates off to college each year, and age isn't a determining factor. So very unhelpful for scouts if they are looking at a mixed bag team of kids all over HS during Summer, when they are sent out specifically to work on their boards. If you are talking about youth ball, which you shouldn't be now, because '21's are done youth ball, than who cares, probably to keep it consistent down the line from the HS brackets, or maybe just to drive the liberals crazy, or maybe because the hockey folks were colluding with the Canadians.

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Originally Posted by Anonymous

Don't understand how lacrosse has not followed Hockey in using birth year instead of year you want your kid to graduate by holding them back. What a joke!

. . . and soccer and football and baseball! Yet, you will hear ad nauseum comments about "it is what is, deal with it", "stop whining", etc, etc. What you won't [b]ever hear is any truly valid argument for a having grade based system for anyone below the high school age.

But in HS, the maturity differences level out around 11th grade, so there isn't as much of a difference by the time you get there. At 2021, you have kids that haven't even sniffed puberty at age 13 and 14 playing against men who are 15 and 16 and are fully mature. Not at all the same as a 16 year old versus a 17 year old.

The Long Island teams were all the same> No new players. I know each of those teams. 9d1 was missing kids. The word was that those kids played for crush. If you were there you would have seen that MOST of the teams except the Long Island teams and a couple of others were older. The older teams were not trying to hide it. These teams think this is proper age. Eclipse had 16 year olds. Same with True.These were not the same Eclipse and True teams that played last year. The parents of the few 14 and many 15 year olds were angry that those kids lost spots to older kids and were no longer starters. Denver - Colorado teams were older too. Not as old as True or Eclipse. One team was very good the other not as good but still good. Again if you were there you would have seen it. I have never seen 9d1,Igloo and express look small before yesterday. This is the way it is going to be until Long island teams catch up to the holdbacks and reclass. 2 year holdbacks are common now outside of New [lacrosse]. No excuses just the truth.

Cause 3D played better than 91. End of story. I don't think there were many 16 year olds playing 2021 at Naptown, if any at all. You can not tell me though that the non NY teams were not loaded with 15 year olds. LI Outlaws, which is a good team, physically looked like 13 and 14 year olds. There was a noticeable size difference between them and every team they played without exception. Just own the fact that your kid is 15 and going into 9th grade and realize that his opponent from NY is 13 or 14. As one father from a non NY team decided to tell everyone on the sideline that his son with a Sept 02 birthday was a youngest on his team, please realize that same player would have been the oldest player on my son's team by 3 months. But, I guess you don't care. LOL.

Eclipse team played great at Naptown. Surprised to see black ice get blown out as did Blaze the next game. Seems like a big change compared to last year

I was there and didn't notice the vast size difference between teams that you are describing.

So I just stumbled onto this thread by accident as I was simply trying to find a replay of the True National 2021 vs. Eclipse championship game played in Annapolis yesterday. My wife flew out east(from Chicago) with my son and I wasn't able to be there and see him play. It's pretty shocking to pull something like this up and see a bunch of garbage assumptions and accusations about a team you know absolutely nothing about. My son has trained with and played for True Lacrosse in Illinois for 5 years now and has done so with the same group of boys he started with - every one of which is still 14yrs old(or younger) and has a graduation year of 2021. They bust their butts nearly year-round under the instruction of True's 2 founders which not only both played D1, but also each played 9yrs in the MLL. They decided to take the game they know and love and grow it in the Midwest where I have to tell you - it has blown up. Believe me when I tell you we have been told far too many times that Midwest kids can't compete with the East Coast in lacrosse!! And our kids hate hearing it!

So to respond to a few of the comments above:

**** "How does a team from Illinois that didn't even win a B 2021 tournament on LI in the fall, make the finals of Naptown nine months later? Please tell." - This one I am happy to explain. True Lacrosse in Illinois alone has several Regional Teams(North Stars, Northwest, West Elite, South, etc....) which cover all of the various suburbs of Chicago........then there are their State Teams which are like "All Star" teams picked from ALL of these Illinois Regional Teams at each age group to play in more serious tournaments(mostly East Coast)..........then there you have other states such as True Indiana, True Idaho, True Michigan, True Kentucky, and so on and so forth..............and THEN their is True National which is selected from a mini tournament/tryout from ALL of the above and plays in 1 and 1 only tournament per year!! That is the team that you saw playing Eclipse in the championship! This happens at every age group and therefore they don't need to pick a bunch of older players and pretend they're 14 - they pick them from HUNDREDS of talented 14yr olds that work extremely hard to be there. So you may have seen a True team that didn't even win in the B division at one of your tournaments, but no 2 teams that go out East are EVER the same because when we come to your tournaments - we fly(or drive 12-14hrs) and we stay in hotels and not every family can spend both the money and the entire summer away from home so our kids can play lacrosse.

**** "Yeah it's a real mystery how true national all of a sudden is the best at most age levels. Must be something in the water out there" - I don't think it's a mystery and I doubt there is anything special in our water - I just know they train hard in every age group from U7 through high school. Where you may have 20 really strong lacrosse clubs to split your talent up - we only have a few. True happens to be the one that wants to test it's talent against the best. This should be a compliment to all of you. We would be happy to have any/all East Coast teams come to Chicago for a tournament, but something tells me you won't want to spend money on flights and hotels like we do each and every time we play you. And it's not really "all of the sudden".

**** "both teams also had many 16 years olds that were 2019 kids" - I can't speak for Eclipse because I have no idea what age their boys were, but that is absolute lie when it comes to True Lacrosse. You can look at our rosters year after year and see 90% of the same names. I am only aware of 2 kids in all of True Illinois who have "re-classed" and neither of them was on this team - it just isn't a "thing" you see done here.

So I hope this novel I've written(which was very therapeutic for me) helps to dispel some of the rumors etc..... you have about True Lacrosse. It should be exciting for you to know the sport is growing and improving around the country and not just in your backyards. Best of luck to all of your sons' in their remaining tournaments!

More like true lies.you need a therapist.i'm sure your wife believes you and the easter bunny.you should join up with the fca tree huggers.mind body and soul.keep believing.

Sounds like somebody's son's team got smacked around by FCA as well.

Finally someone is trying to move to age base
NXT Sports
https://nxtsports.com/blog/entry/nx...to-adopt-us-lacrosse-age-segmentation-p/

FCA, the biggest scam in club lacrosse, countrywide. Hiding behind a religious front that is so far from that, it is pathetic.

While I appreciateand accept your very well detailed answers and also understand these are national teams from out of your organization, there were older kids on the team. I have no issue and congratulate your boys on hitting the finals. However, we were talking to a parent on your team whose younger son is older than 8 of our players on 2021 and plays for True 2022.
So while I get your explanations, and I am happy the boys did well, I am sure if we went through the USL numbers of your rostered players, we wouldn't be surprised to see kids 12-18 months older in the 'mix.

No sour grapes here, we play what you bring and don't complain, but I think you are kidding yourself somewhat.

My son is a 2020 and last summer it was totally crazy how many coaches were on the sidelines, this summer a few here and there. Any my son is on a team that is playing at all the top events. Has there been any coaches on the 2021 sidelines? I am super happy about the fact that is does look like the coaches are following the new rules. I have to also say, I have noticed plenty of 2029 "commits" having less than stellar summers. Looks like the pressure may be getting to some of them, IMO air looks like they are trying to do too much. Also, some of the "commits" that are older have now lost their edge and are really struggling. Just my observation, anyone else have input?

Talk to the parents on your True team. They were the ones that said the team was older " but legal" at Naptown. Last year they were older too. They played in PA last year and those parents admitted they were older except that was True Illinois. There are also kids on your 2022 team that would be 2020 in New [lacrosse]. Next year you may want to tell the parents not to talk.

My son is a 2021 that has been to all the top tournaments and showcases this year, including Showtime. Barely any coaches have been watching from what I can see.

Empire playing A at NLF this weekend. Good to see they are not planing B. Some very good teams playing in A . Is this a recruitment event with college coaches?

No coaches in sight for 2021

That is everywhere. Seems 2021 not getting looks. Makes sense. Those kids will change so much in the next year.

Totally they way it should be - let 15 year olds just play the game! Even without the prospects of recruiting, they can still strive to be the best they can be and develop, but they don;t have the unnecessary stresses that go along with the early recruiting. Unfortunately, there are some parents out there pulling their hair out because Johnny isn't getting attention and can't now get that early commitment!

you mean 14 year olds, right?

Was referencing 2021s, who are all moving to the next season at this point - tryouts already starting, so referring to them as 15 year olds seems appropriate. But yes, the 2022s are now 14 year olds then. That said, the 2021s, like the 2020s this past season, should get to just play for the sake of playing also. That's what the whole NCAA rule change gets at.

Our 2021 team does not have one 15 year old yet, I understand that by end of 2017 the team if it stays the same will have one which has a Dec 2002 birthday. I called our director and asked for our team and I wrote this as just curious of the few previous posts which said 15 year olds for 2021 and 14 for 2022 teams as my son is turning 14 in Oct of this year. Was out at the NLF tourney this weekend and saw the size and maturity of some of the 2021 kids on some of the teams like Eclipse, Team 91, the Boston Black team (what a difference in size and maturity as compared to their yellow team in the same 2021 year) , just curious the actually age of some of them. I know this is when their body changes. One of the other parents said they thought some of the kids were already 15 and turning 16, on some of the teams. Does anyone know when rosters are submitted are birthdates included. Also who runs the NLF as I thought it was strange that Team 91 played one tough game in league play and the other tougher teams played each other. As they lost to Eclipse but yet made the playoffs and Eclipse did not and they had the same 3-1 record but Eclipse played tougher teams. Another game which seemed spirited was Express losing to Icon, for the most part can't say I saw any kids I thought were 15-16 years on either of those teams.

What do folks think of the Warrior NPI going on down in Richmond today and tomorrow?

PS - Regarding age, I understand the trend among private schools is that boys born April - Summer start school late. So that would account for a number of kids playing 2021 this Summer as 15-year olds. If a kid "reclasses," then he would have been 16. I can't imagine why you'd hold back a kid who started school late like that, but who knows?