BOTC - US Lacrosse Community Forum Forums MID-ATLANTIC LACROSSE MARYLAND FORUM Greater Howard Club Lacrosse Conference (HoCo)

I agree / you are right - "victim" is a wrong word choice for mostly upper middle class kids playing a game. I was responding to a prior poster about the repercussions of the holdback scenario in which good on age players are relegated to role players due to the impact of the holdbacks. By no means a crime! But, the cycle repeats itself as those kids / parents weigh their options. No qualms about losing a spot to a better player, but to a older player in youth sports is not fair play as we would all like to believe it was intended. Thanks!

How are the UA tryouts looking at Goucher? Any feedback or perspective?

Does your kid play for Crabs? If not, why do you care about crabs bringing in holdbacks that take on age kids spots? My on age son is on crabs and we all understand that possibility going in. If it happens, you move on. I appreciate your concern for my child though.

I don't care what you do with your kid. If you want to associate yourself with the Crabs - that is your decision. If your kid is on age and isn't a superstar be prepared to re-class or be shown the door in the 7th and 8th grade.

Bottom line is grade based classification opens up youth lacrosse to people gaming the system. 16 year olds should not be on 8th grade teams. If you want to stay grade based - do it with an age cut off - just like WSYL last year in Denver. How did that work out for the fat crab?

Looks pretty good probably 150 kids from a lot of the big clubs around like crabs, FCA, looneys, team91. The talent out there is top notch and there was a good turnout from the college coaches as well.

You are a hypocrite for the reasons I stated above.
Now you bring out some new straw men! I can choose to reclass my kids if I want and enjoy the advantage like other people do at the Youth level. No thanks. I have always taught my children to compete with other children like them or older. Not compete against younger children like YOU claim is ok.

I also like your BS Straw man line about how I feel like my son only needs to play against kids his own age. Who said that, Only YOU. My one son who is finished now with lacrosse played high level from a child to college. Never once did I consider him playing against YOUNGER children until HS. Then it really didn’t matter. As he went being the youngest to oldest as he went thru HS. My other is in the system now starting his HS years. He never played down against younger children. O and by way it is a MIAA school. That is why I know so much about the world of holdbacks and prefirsts. I could care less that a parent holds his child back, but this ridiculous notion of changing Club Youth lacrosse to allow only select kids to play down is terrible. It is not the way the game was meant to be played. Maybe in your world it is OK playing down but not mine.

It ceases to amaze me how people like you go on and on about us whining about holdbacks and we need to toughen our sons up, or they only want to play against their own age instead of older players,etc,etc. You along with the rest of the holdback apologists try to paint us like we are just scared to compete. When in reality it is apologists like you who are afraid to compete on a level playing field.

It's I "couldn't" care less.

I don't feel the need to have my son play down. As I said, my son is on age, also at an MIAA school. I just don't think it's the worst thing in the world for him to play some older kids. I grew up playing that way. My older son went through when things were U-9, U-11, U-13, U-15 and was always playing older kids. If parents feel their son needs that, that's their decision. It doesn't really effect me. Not sure why you are so offended by it.

You are only half way correct your son played older kids every other year. The second year at U-11 or U13 your son was the older kid playing with some kids 1 and a half years younger give or take. So you need a one year system to be fair. So life does not have to be fair but people should try to make thing close to fair as possible when dealing with kids.

My point is, grade based is new. It was never single age. So why is everyone up in arms about kids having to play older kids? THey always have.

BECAUSE YOU NEVER HAD TEAMS GAMING THE SYSTEM AND PUTTING 16 YEAR OLDS ON THE FIELD WITH 13 YEAR OLDS.

Thanks!

So when the system was setup to have 15 yr okra playing with 13 year old that was ok? I guarantee you on average the age spread between kids is less now than it's ever been.

If you were 16 and post puberty you were done with youth lacrosse. Not in this bizarro arrangement.

Are you really that dense?? grade base is new so what? A single year would be new also?? A single year would have been the right way to do a new lacrosse league or grade with age restrictions.
The lame argument again about kids have always played older kids.
So from that lame argument you get , why not let all the prefirst/holdback kids be the oldest and playdown?? Why Not! LOL

Single age is the best setup says who? I just don't get it and my son in on age. Who cares if there are kids older than him? He's not getting recruited in 7th grade.

Looking at other youth sports and using some common sense. I got that from US Soccer who has 3 million registered players,over 200 million worldwide, Single Year birthday!The horror of Soccer!! US Hockey who has over half million registered players, Baseball Several governing bodies several million playing, football several orgs. Several million players,etc.
None of these much larger organizations allow kids to play down unless there is some very good reason. Not he was held back in kindergarten so shouldn't he get an advantage ??

But HOCO and the holdback people like you know what is better for our youth lacrosse players. Grade base teams with children allowed to play down. Or as you apologists like to say. Why do you care if you play against older children who are playing down. But I never hear the part about the older kids are playing down, just why do you care about playing older children.

You are the dense one! Do you people not realize that in other parts of the country the sport of lacrosse is not as popular as it is in MD or LI . States where the sport is just catching on couldn't possibly field multiple teams for a rec league or a local travel club team without combining years i.e. U9, u11 etc. You simple can't compare lacrosse to soccer or basketball because the participation is just not there yet. There is always going to be a age differences. As far as isolated examples of 16 yr olds vs 13 yr olds... you combine the arrival of the 8th grade and growth spurts for some with the unfortunate early recruiting process and it's obvious why already talented players choose to try and secure a roster spot. Most if not all these players have stood out and played up for years and now it's time for the decision makers on the sidelines to watch these boys compete against kids in the same high school graduating year. If you have the means and you believe your son actually has a shot to play at the next Level knock yourself out parents.

Do you actually believe what you write??
What does how many participate have to do with grade base or age base teams?? So what if it is two year with lacrosse and one year with other sports?

One year when you are younger you play A if good enough, the next year you are oldest and play A if good player. No one complained about that. And that is how it is in many parts of country now that doesn't have this holdback mentality.

Where are all these players playing up?? What are you talking about? Flat out BS. In two year structure they play up first year, next year they are oldest. And what does that have to do with grade base vs age base, besides once again proving age base is the fairest way to play Youth sports.

just because 8th grade is before HS doesnt mean all youth sports needs to be grade base and let holdbacks play down?? Why do we need to let players play down in 4th grade??? What reason could their be??? The last 50 years it seems we didnt have a problem..But now we do?? WE need to let little Johnny play with his grade even tho he is older?? Little Johnny can get his advantage on his school teams, not youth level,

No reclassed player plays up. Complete nonsense.

Bottom line. Hoco's top divisions are the best leagues in the country played by the rules the clubs wish to play by. Please whine somewhere else. Please play a club or rec team that uses the rules you prefer instead of constantly crying.

You must be a Crabs parent. How many 16 year olds on your 8th grade 2020 team? [lacrosse] many kids who will be 16 by the end of the year on your 2020 team? How many kids on your 2020 team will be in your 2021 team next year.

You won't answer because it's too damn embarrassing,

You are completely correct, the meathead parents of the holdbacks won't answer, never will, but they pound their chest when the see their big players on the field pushing around 13 year olds. They actually think their holdbacks are good lacrosse players. They aren't, I have seen Crabs 2020 team play at least 4 times this year. The only good players are the goalies, the rest of the holdbacks are just that, big oversized 15/16 year old 8th graders, but at most, and I mean AT MOST they are just average lacrosse players.

Here's your tissue....

Like a poster pointed out few days ago. Meat head holdback parent will watch his holdback player secure an early roster spot which will ultimately get him in with the good ol boys lacrosse club and land him a top job while you, your wife and your son all sit around whining about it to each other as you watch the recruiting train go bye. We are all laughing at all of you boneheads who continue to complain. hahahah

My kid is on age and is committed to an Ivy. Sorry pal - not everyone has to cheat to make it.

Actually most kids don't have to cheat- only the ones that need to, do so! No recruiting train passing by all the talented kids I know- in fact- they're doing better than their older counter parts that were left back- academically and athletically. Congrats to your kid- obviously he has what it takes and didn't need a helping hand.

Thank you HoCo

I am very sad for you/your son. If your goals for him are "getting in with the good old boys so they can help him get a job"!! Seriously, you may want to re-evaluate his life goals. Wow

Second that - maybe they can get a job with one of Bernie Madoff's sons...

I'm real sorry for your son, that you come to an anonymous forumn and get offended and cry foul when someone is messing with you... Get a life you big sissy

Crab parents are such special people. The embodiment of everything wrong with youth lacrosse

Those numbers r not true. Crabs do cheat it's no secret. A kid named Wilson from Texas flew in to play on Crabs 2020 team in the Crab Feast Tournament. BL also encourages kids to "fail" when coming coming from another school. Poor sucker these clown parents fail their kids and think it's good for them. It's cheating and they r doing it to gain advantage over their peers. They must have Napolean syndrome hoping there kid will be bigger and smarter to get ahead!! BL stands for Big Liars!!! The scores listed are wrong for Crabs. 2020-2023 all lost more games than listed. They r no better than any other club and now they r going downhill with the age change. They will find a way to cheat and keep bragging about the wins and never produce graduating years to show even playing ground. Or pay in NonSanctionec age based tourn. The Parents justify their decisions by seeking an IVY school or hopes of a free ride, but they will have spent $175,00 to get there!!! Makes no sense!

Just to clear up one thing, they do not have to fail any classes to reclass. In private school settings its up to the parents if they want to hold the child back.

This is the most asinine post I've ever seen. Kids aren't failing to repeat grades.

Proper way should have been " BL also encourages kids to repeat a grade " when coming coming from another school. ..You know become a holdback. It always amazes me how everyone raves about the MIAA. They should be the best in Md HS lacrosse as many players should be college Freshman, along with other factors

Tryouts are coming up for next season and starting next week and going throughout August.

Here are the HoCo clubs and the general level of play (AA, A, B)

Anne Arundel County
AA
Diamondbacks
Hawks
B
Peninsula (PLC)
Rockfish
Sidewinders
Snappers
Swarm
Wild


Baltimore City – North / Towson
AA
Crabs
FCA
Team 91 MD
A
Koopers
Rock
B
Breakers
Coppermine
Greene Turtle
Lax World
Looneys
Team 42
Wolfpack

West Baltimore County
B
Bitmore

Calvert County
AA
Cannons

Carroll County
B
Gonzo

Fairfax County (VA)
A
VLC
B
Cavalier

Frederick County
A
Lax Factory

Harford County
A
Thunder
B
Starz

Howard County
AA
Rough Riders
A
HoCo
B
Zingos

Loudon County (VA)
AA
3D

Montgomery County – North
B
Xtreme

Montgomery County - West
AA
Bethesda
Madlax
A
Club Blue
Next Level
B
Performance Knights


Queen Anne’s County
AA
Storm
B
Triple Threat

Talbot County
B
Dark Horse

Washington County
A
Lion Heart

great list!

Except the Xtreme folks are going to come one here and rant that they are a AA club - especially the delusional 2020 team

Well for VA Loundon Co.
The 3D team is a A to high B team for sure. I also would say Cavs are Loundon not Fairfax team

I feel sorry for your son...and your wife.