BOTC - US Lacrosse Community Forum Forums MID-ATLANTIC LACROSSE MARYLAND FORUM Greater Howard Club Lacrosse Conference (HoCo)

CRABS 2020 through 6th grade lost to VLC, Rough Riders, Loonies, Rising Sons and Team Ninety One. 7th Grade they lost to Loonies, Edge, Team 91. 8th grade they haven't lost to anyone yet and probably wont. They went from 3 holdbacks in 6th grade to over 10 in 8th grade...there is a prytern....more holdbacks...less losses..they know what they are doing.

The farce in all of this is that if your son is on age and is playing in either the 2021, or 2020 Hoco "Elite Divisions" he is effectively "playing up," against boys one to two years older. This is not by choice, but because the dominant teams are loaded with hold backs who are choosing to play down. The result is predictable and dangerous and the adults who theoretically are responsible (and even more theoretically should care) do and say nothing and pretend that this is nothing more than healthy competition.

The "big boys" win by literally running over their opponents; not because of their athletic skill, but due to their size and bulk. A 6 inch difference in height and 50 pound difference in weight are decisive advantages, particularly when that is replicated across an entire team.

Please do not recycle the argument that its "almost" high school where there is a four year age span. It may "almost" be high school, but it is still supposed to be youth lacrosse.

The farce in all of this is that if your son is on age and is playing in either the 2021, or 2020 Hoco "Elite Divisions" he is effectively "playing up," against boys one to two years older. This is not by choice, but because the dominant teams are loaded with hold backs who are choosing to play down. The result is predictable and dangerous and the adults who theoretically are responsible (and even more theoretically should care) do and say nothing and pretend that this is nothing more than healthy competition.

The "big boys" win by literally running over their opponents; not because of their athletic skill, but due to their size and bulk. A 6 inch difference in height and 50 pound difference in weight are decisive advantages, particularly when that is replicated across an entire team.

Please do not recycle the argument that its "almost" high school where there is a four year age span. It may "almost" be high school, but it is still supposed to be youth lacrosse.

Are you [lacrosse]? Your stupid post makes no sense.... Stay of the meth please

I'm so right I'll post it twice

Quit you belly aching....If you a guy I feel sorry for your wife marrying such a feminine man.....[lacrosse]

Sorry you son is weak and plays on a crappy team...Man up and get his some training or even better...Get off the couch and help him be a better player so he can play for the teams you mentioned..... Totally week to sit back on an anymous forumn and throw stone...[lacrosse] off

It's really all they talk about on the site....Rather boring.....It's more fun to mess with people and bust their chops

You guys make me laugh. No one is "playing down" as the league is grade based. Go play in MYLA if you want to be age based. If your son is playing in one of the Elite divisions, be proud of him. He is playing with and against some of the best players in the country in his grade. All the teams in the Elite divisions have holdbacks, so singling any team out is a useless exercise. Don't be high and mighty and act like your club wouldn't take the holdback kids on Crabs in a heartbeat if they wanted to change to your club. It's disingenuous. It all boils down to the fact that Crabs wins a lot. Considering it's middle school, who really cares? Is your son getting better playing with and against holdbacks? Of course he is and that's really what should matter, not a frigging free t-shirt.

Perfect...Finally a post not to mess with...Thank you for that!

Please go back to Rec...Your kids teams loose to these teams because they are not as good as these teams period....If you are bitching about the "fairness" of club lacrosse then I really think it's not for you.. Rec might be a better option for you

Please go back to Rec.....You and your kid do not belong in club if you are complaining about the competitiveness of club....Rec has it's place, and it's a great fit for you. I for one want my kids to play the best competition no matter what age/grade formula. That's why my kids play for great clubs and I don not complain about other clubs when they win... Calling them cheaters is bush league.. Go back to Rec....It needs you

Actually a great post...the only ones who take issue with it are Crabs who are guilty and hoco who are the adults letting the non holdbacks down.

The 6 inches taller and 50lbs heavier argument doesn't work because there are plenty of boys that are huge and on age. Can't be angry about kids that are bigger, stronger, and faster then your kid and the same age. All kids mature at different times. If your boy is small for 8th grade...maybe it will flip flop by his senior year in high school. Many of these elite teams "studs" have matured early and the catch up game can be humbling to many of them. When they are juniors and kids they could run by and muscle through easily as 8th graders catch up. Then they have to learn to play at the next level. Many won't make this transition. Seen it for years. Just sit back, enjoy the game and the experience. Don't worry about holdbacks. Life has plenty of holdback moments. Always gonna be people stacking the odds and positioning for better opportunities.

The problem is that you are playing down effectively forcing everyone else to play up. You do not get to make that choice for all the other kids. It is not competitiveness - most on age boys in the elite division have superior stick skills and lacrosse IQ then the hold backs who simply brute force their way through. If that is not the case in your opinion, then go play where you belong - 9th and 10 th grade as opposed to ruining a league and telling those who belong to go back to rec. YOU ruined the league and grade based lacrosse - not the on age kids.

Such an original response from the people ruining youth lacrosse. Go collect your trophies and tell your man boys how wonderful they are for beating up on younger kids and then tell them you did it to them to make up for their inability to compete with the grade they belong.

No is complaining about the competitiveness of club lacrosse. What people are complaining about is when 2020 teams have kids on the roster that are 16 years old. Yes - Crabs this means you. Can't compete - repeat.

Wrong...How can you complain about competing whether its older or younger...Quit complaining...If your kid belonged then you would not be complaining....Go back to Rec....Everyone plays....Equal teams, Everyone gets a trophy...they need you back...Club lacrosse does not...I for one love the competition and that is why we play club lacrosse......Keep your Rec complaints at Rec...Your point is not valid. I want my kids to play the best so they get better... Its does not matter how old they are.....Beliefs that you are always writing about have ruined club lacrosse...How about all of the non-elite teams go back to Rec as well.......Whoever heard of "B" club lacrosse....Ridiculous. AA, A, B teams really??? Those are glorified rec teams....

This is YOUTH lacrosse. Kids as large as the holdbacks are the exception to the rule and maybe 6-10 spread out among the 40 2020 teams. You are putting kids in danger and at a disadvantage by adding more kids high school size to the field. There is no justification for it - ever. The one off large player can be worked around 6-10 on a team can not be worked around.

Nobody cares about a tee shirt except maybe the Crabs and Looneys who will do anything for a win including distort the whole purpose of youth lacrosse. Don't lecture the people that are doing it correctly - there are some teams out there still that have a shred of integrity and are not all about winning all the time. Afterall as you said - this is middle school lacrosse and these people have their kids repeat grades in middle school and then expect everyone else to just accept it. Get a grip on that desperate measure in middle school. It has nothing to do with the Crabs winning alot - their wins actually mean nothing as any good 2019 team could beat most 2020 elite teams just due to the size difference between 13 and 15 year old boys who have not yet hit puberty yet. It is also about right and wrong and safety and the fact that the sport has become a cesspool because of people who think like the above poster but it is actually useless because those who are doing this always have an excuse for their little johnny and always will.

If these kids have to play down in order to be seen then they are not good enough for their own age group and are the ones that probably belong in rec - in their proper age group. Talk about a major elitist attitude. You must have one of the kids that have to play down to be relevant. This is not offering more competition - that is just bullying your way through the truly talented kids who have not yet had their growth spurt. Spin it anyway you like - true talent plays up. You are not even playing with your own age group much less up and explain it away that you are offering more competition to the kids that belong in the grade. What a joke. If you can't win with your own age, then you do not belong on the field with younger kids to make yourself feel like a winner.

Ahh....Thank you for clearing this up. Now I understand; as you say....

"you and your kid do not belong in club if you are complaining about the competitiveness of club.

This is rich on several levels.

First, while my son participates on two club teams (one of which plays in the HOCO 2021 Elite Division), I do not and I do not pretend to “belong in club”. I am a little old for club lacrosse and I suspect you are too. Seems like someone might be living a bit vicariously through their son (hint it’s not me).

Second, from your comment, I gather I cannot complain because (as you say) competition "...no matter what age/grade formula..." (and against kids who are playing down), is always good and builds character (after all, we are all men but some of us are more manly than others). If playing up and seeking the best competition you can is “good” what does this say about the hold backs and their coaches and parents who actively are seeking to have their sons and their teams play against younger, less competitive teams? Are they seeking the "best competition," or they seeking the best record for a trophy and bragging rights?

Third, is your son a hold back? If so, using your own argument, perhaps you and your son do not belong in club lacrosse since that would presumably mean that you and your son are not seeking the best competition.

He just dropped the mic.

So glad we have people like you post about this issue. It just reinforces the disgust the MAJORITY of people who have sons playing YOUTH lacrosse feel. Frankly the Majority of people you ask that have been involved in Youth lacrosse feel the same disgust. Anyone with common sense knows this is wrong at youth level. But we will always have people like you and RM to let us know different. LOL

By your statements and attitude I would guess you are associated with Crabs and if you aren't you should be because the yell out this sh*t on a daily basis. I would also guess your kid is a holdback. Of course you are going to deny it but I know he is, just from your flawed statements.
There is a place for AA, A and B club teams/leagues. I am glad you are not in charge of a youth league, it would surely be a clusterf**k, with you leading the way. It does matter how old kids are in youth lacrosse. Crabs is loaded with 15 and 16 year olds playing against 13 and 14 year olds. You don't learn from that situation nor do you get better. You get better playing against talented players in your own age range, that is how you improve.
You are acting like a total jerk and it is apparent you have no idea what youth lacrosse is about, you feel since your kid (probably a holdback) is playing on an elite team, all other divisions are useless. Perhaps you are one of Crabs lapdogs.

Oh yeah well your acting like a jerk to....God I hope your a female because if your are not I think you get your poop pushed in on a daily basis.

Man it must be tough to climb down from that high horse of yours.....Your really full of yourself (as I would say)

Yup and the majority of kids playing club lacrosse right now should be playing Rec...I get the guys point totally.....

Nope, not a female, but I heard your wife does, after she does 5 day workers from Home Depot on a daily basis. Guess the money helps pay the Crabs fees for your elite kid. Now you know the rest of the story.

Are you ten? The person who posted is 100% correct. As usual, a holdback parent always comes back with insults when the flaws in their logic are pointed out.

/quote] Man it must be tough to climb down from that high horse of yours.....Your really full of yourself (as I would say)[/quote]

The poster is just pointing out the usual bs logic of Crab and holdback parents. And again, you react with insults.

BOTC, are you seriously going to allow this misogynistic and homophobic drivel on your forum? This is uncalled for.

Any chance Crabs 2020 loses a game in HOCO? lol

By your statements and attitude I would guess you are associated with Crabs and if you aren't you should be because the yell out this sh*t on a daily basis. I would also guess your kid is a holdback. Of course you are going to deny it but I know he is, just from your flawed statements.
There is a place for AA, A and B club teams/leagues. I am glad you are not in charge of a youth league, it would surely be a clusterf**k, with you leading the way. It does matter how old kids are in youth lacrosse. Crabs is loaded with 15 and 16 year olds playing against 13 and 14 year olds. You don't learn from that situation nor do you get better. You get better playing against talented players in your own age range, that is how you improve.
You are acting like a total jerk and it is apparent you have no idea what youth lacrosse is about, you feel since your kid (probably a holdback) is playing on an elite team, all other divisions are useless. Perhaps you are one of Crabs lapdogs.


[/quote] Oh yeah well your acting like a jerk to....God I hope your a female because if your are not I think you get your poop pushed in on a daily basis.[/quote]

Wow. What a thoughtful response and so literate. By the way that would be "too" not "to." Spell much?

Keep posting your dumb holdback comments and just going to destroy you every time you comment....You make yourself look stupid because your claims are full of lies and half truths....Get over yourself.....Oh and boy the way my kid plays baseball

Whatever lady...

Predictable.

Are you ten? The person who posted is 100% correct. As usual, a holdback parent always comes back with insults when the flaws in their logic are pointed out. [/quote]

Whatever lady...[/quote]

Really, is that the best you can do? You realize that you have just proved the poster right. You are such an a## that you can only respond with silly insults.

Another typical Crab response, maybe this is from fat Crab daddy's wife.

We could care less what you kid plays. Comments on this forum about holdbacks and in particular Crabs holdbacks, are on point, accurate and timely. You seem to be the one looking stupid, your kid plays baseball and here you are on a youth lacrosse forum making stupid statements. You are the one that needs to get over themselves, but doubt that will happen, you seem to be full of yourself.