BOTC - US Lacrosse Community Forum Forums NORTHEAST LACROSSE BOTC MAIN FORUM (LI, CT, WC) Age Verification

Thank you for your jab at our Bilingual and inclusive country. As a Director of Canadian Lacrosse I have now been motivated to again point out to you that reclassification started in NE and Maryland and perfected by 3d based in Colorado. Thank you for again showing your US bias and exceptionally low lack of awareness. USA USA USA

Edge lacrosse doesn't have reclassed players, they just register teams in younger divisions for an advantage. That is blatant cheating.

I think Canadian families just want their kids to have an opportunity to go to college in the US. It is a country where less than 1/5th of adults have a college education and Canada has only three cities which could reasonably be classified as white collar higher income job markets. For the most part Canada is still an agrarian economy and families what better. I do concur with the moderator and other posters that the cheap vehicle into US colleges to play kids down is the opposite of every Canadian "farm tough" well and hard earned stereotype I knew of growing up. Anyone think Gordie Howe, Bobby Clark or Mark Messier would have played down to compete? They'd play up and punch you in the face before the face-off just to let you know they were coming and wouldn't quit. Now, we've all moved on from punching being ok in sports, but really what Canadians now do in lacrosse is about as bold as starting a men's figure skating program to pull hockey players away in the fields of Manitoba.

And thanks for the comments directed at Maryland or other US area parents. As a parent of three proper school year aged kids and a proponent of age based club teams, I applaud the bashing of our peer group around here. It is abysmal that the American way in lacrosse is playing down to avoid the confrontation of real and fair sports competition at all costs. It is something we all need to fix.

Great post except for the finale. The minority of American clubs and players play down or PG. Therefore it is far from the "American way" as you said.

The vast majority of us play our kids on or above the appropriate age group for reasons that mirror your thoughts exactly.

Thank you for shining some light on how the majority of Canadian parents feel about the issue of playing down. Good day.

One commentary on 2019 subject states a vast majority of rising freshman at JR will be 15. How is that? Would love to hear the age the LI players who got invited to JR will be. I dont think a vast majority (more like the minority) will be 15. I hope it is under a handful.

Excellent post. The majority of the anger and frustration surrounding the holdback/playing down topic pertains to 8th grade and below. For the simple reason that playing JV or varsity will automatically subject boys to playing older, bigger kids. Everyone knows that and accepts the challenges and risks associated with it. In the absence of a learning disability, holding a kid back or playing kids down a year prior to high school is an indignity to the principles of sportsmanship and fair play. A parent's desire to provide the best opportunities for their son does not absolve them from their responsibilities to the rest of the community.

Great post except for the finale. The minority of American clubs and players play down or PG. Therefore it is far from the "American way" as you said.

The vast majority of us play our kids on or above the appropriate age group for reasons that mirror your thoughts exactly.

Thank you for shining some light on how the majority of Canadian parents feel about the issue of playing down. Good day.

"Trying to keep the civility in this commentary, there is an overwhelming majority of Maryland prep school kids who have repeated a middle school year."

overwhelming majority? Let's not get carried away. So much of this is driven by perception and not reality. For instance a Canadian club plays their teams down a year because they perceive that that's what all US teams do. What is true that if you have a summer birthday (Sept 1 is cutoff in MD) and go to a MD private grade school that they'll almost always make the kid do a pre 1st. So maybe a third of the private school grammar kids are held back. But what's the percentage of families that are willing and able to foot $20-30K for grade school even amongst the lax community? For the rest of us public school families (the overwhelming majority) you start your kid in kindergarten if he/she is 5 before 9/1 unless you can show the school system a reason. Yes there are some misguided folks who have their kid repeat a grade in middle school for sports- usually 8th grade. But that's just a handful of kids each year and some private allow that and others don't. My point is not to defend reclassing but lend perspective to the reality. I know this by being involved rec lacrosse in Baltimore for many years. My estimate is that on average you will have around 3-4 kids on a grade based MD team that wouldn't qualify for the equivalent age-based with 9/1 cutoff. And most of those hold back kids are in within 3 months of what the us lax age cutoff would be. So personally I think the single year grade works just as well as 2 year age that had been the norm for so many years. Though I would be in full support of single year age. Not sure that will happen.

I think Canadian families just want their kids to have an opportunity to go to college in the US. It is a country where less than 1/5th of adults have a college education and Canada has only three cities which could reasonably be classified as white collar higher income job markets. For the most part Canada is still an agrarian economy and families what better. I do concur with the moderator and other posters that the cheap vehicle into US colleges to play kids down is the opposite of every Canadian "farm tough" well and hard earned stereotype I knew of growing up. Anyone think Gordie Howe, Bobby Clark or Mark Messier would have played down to compete? They'd play up and punch you in the face before the face-off just to let you know they were coming and wouldn't quit. Now, we've all moved on from punching being ok in sports, but really what Canadians now do in lacrosse is about as bold as starting a men's figure skating program to pull hockey players away in the fields of Manitoba.

And thanks for the comments directed at Maryland or other US area parents. As a parent of three proper school year aged kids and a proponent of age based club teams, I applaud the bashing of our peer group around here. It is abysmal that the American way in lacrosse is playing down to avoid the confrontation of real and fair sports competition at all costs. It is something we all need to fix.

Does 28% equal less than 1/5 in the United States? 31.96% of Americans have university degrees, so not exactly some great divide. Overall, Canada is more educated with over half the adult population holding tertiary education, only 41.89% in the US. Canada has roughly the same population as California (slightly lower by 3 or 4 million), yet California has almost double the amount of universities. So, California is either incredibly smart or.... it's super easy to get into any university outside the top 20%. I feel safe leaning to the latter and in believing that the incredibly attainable standards of UC-Merced(89% acceptance) and such, help explain the 3.96% difference in degree holders.

I get that you want to make disparaging comments about Canada because you are upset at Edge, but think first. Like granted, you are correct that Canada only has few "white-collared" cities. Too bad you didn't consider the fact that are far less people. California only has a few "white-collared" cities too, so seems about right doesn't it?

As for getting punched in the face, bring your child up to Canada for some box. It's all age-certified so you LI types should feel safe. Munro's kid has done it for years and he's a coward, low life, holdback, right? If your kid actually has the stones to do it, you'll find what you described, no kids playing down and the best kids playing up. Make Crabs and Dukes follow some rules and I'm sure Edge will too.

Can you imagine the LI dad's in the Bunny Barn in late July? The smell of sweat, drakar and axe body spray would be overwhelming while little Johnny got pounded up and down the floor.

Why can't you guys just be honest. Nobody on this forum was complaining about reclassification, PGs and hold backs until the Canadian team blew up the Express. It was a game. Your team lost badly just as you did to the Crabs, move on.

It becomes obvious when players who were on a year older team all of the sudden are on a year younger team. When playing age appropriate which is usually up till 8th grade the Long Island teams seem to dominate most not all regions and even Canadian teams. When the PG comes into effect and an 8th grader repeats and now plays on a team a year younger then they win. That's the obvious thing.

Am I the only one who thinks the average 8th grade boy would go nuts if you told him he had to repeat 8th grade, graduate a year later. Most kid sin HS are counting the days till they are done.

Why can't you guys just be honest. Nobody on this forum was complaining about reclassification, PGs and hold backs until the Canadian team blew up the Express. It was a game. Your team lost badly just as you did to the Crabs, move on.

I disagree there was anger when it was public a Long Island boy did it. When it impacted a high school admission or boys transferring from on catholic to another. 2014/2016/2017/2018/2019/2020/2021 all have the issue. Goes down to second grade.

Then a boy got hurt playing against Edge and all crap broke loose. I would not be surprised if it was the parents (or family/friends) of that child alerting people to the fact of playing down. Why because the boy got hurt. Good for them for not letting go of it.

Had nothing to do about a team, someone got hurt and the explanation from The organization was a lie. Then it blew up.

Why can't you guys just be honest. Nobody on this forum was complaining about reclassification, PGs and hold backs until the Canadian team blew up the Express. It was a game. Your team lost badly just as you did to the Crabs, move on.

What is a youth player. Is it a player under a certain age or under a certain grade?

Money always changes things, but I had asked a while ago (may understandably get censored) are there any US Lacrosse brd members (across the country) who have held back players (sons/daughters), as defined as started or will start HS Older than 14.

I am not looking for names just a simple yes or no. This will ultimately show the usefulness of US Lacrosse.

Lets remember US Lacrosse established the 2 year U designation to promote lacrosse and help garner sign ups. The 2 year U designation was not to hold competitive teams to a 2 year standard. It was so rec and town leagues had parameters for teams. These parametrs were 2 years to help enrollment so you had ample quatity of players.

US Lacrosse seems like if needs to take a page from US Soccer.
The structure of local, regional and national leagues as well as age verification and player passes.

A youth player is one who is not yet in High School.

So a 15 not in HS is a youth? There has to be an age threshold

After watching the Petro interview on LaxMagazine, one take away I have is if kids weren't able to commit as 8th and 9th graders, and if coaches cooled off on actively recruiting until Sept 1 of junior year, a lot of pressure would come off the "youth" game. With all eggs in the 8th grade basket to get noticed or miss chances at Hopkins and the others, if we can ice the supply side it would help cool the demand side. US Lacrosse has come in with age based best practices. The lacrosse industry just ignored them. This seems to be a unique sport in that nobody in the sport has one iota of respect or reverence from the governing body of the sport.

I'm a parent of a PA 2019 player fairly new to club lacrosse. We just returned from a trip to Maryland my sons team played against a Long Island Express team, Madlax and another I don't recall. I was shocked by the size and more so the muscle mass of many of the Madlax players. They looked like men playing amongst boys. I assume that is what to expect this summer but I was wondering if this is one of the clubs that plays players in lower age groups? Do the Maryland kids start school a year later? Just curious. My son is large for his age, thank god.

Also I noticed the refs allowed very violent stick checking, is that permitted in Maryland more so than in Pa and NY?

Thanks for any insight.