BOTC - US Lacrosse Community Forum Forums NORTHEAST LACROSSE BOTC MAIN FORUM (LI, CT, WC) Boys 2017 Fall 2013/Summer 2014

All going Ivy.......yeah right. Keep drinking the juice!!!

Actually 2 went, didn't they? Just left the program this year I beieve...so much jealousy against the Turtles.

More than two left the turtles this season, one is commited and other player will commit soon. They aren't Turtles. Play for 91. Not jealousy, you Turtle folks made this hate years ago, your coaches helped.

Two went? One went to 91 and just committed and the other left top of LAST season to other express team and he isn't committed yet.

"All" is some strong language...........

Why did would they leave the Turtles? ( Serious question... aren't they the top team for 2017?)

I find this very surprising and disappointing if there are kids leaving the Turtles. I am a MD dad, and I must say the Turtles were unquestionably the finest 2017 team we saw last Summer and they were the only team that looks polished and together this Fall. They play great lacrosse and had a lot of very good looking players insofar as recruiting. If something that good can't stay on, there must be really something wrong in our sport. The Turtles parents and the Turtles coaches being this negative and that negative...bla-hooey I say. All high flight 2017 club teams have crazy parents and crazier club owners, including ours.

It's not jealousy. It's pity.

Hi, Turtle Dad.

Saving this post for the archives ...

Hi, Turtle Dad. [/quote]

Merry XMas from a Madlax Dad. Wow, you LI guys are precious. No wonder the NY Jets can still sell out games. You like being miserable.

yes, 2 went, plus the other from last season

Just like some other boys, turtles have options on the table . Nothing taken yet.

Merry XMas from a Madlax Dad. Wow, you LI guys are precious. No wonder the NY Jets can still sell out games. You like being miserable. [/quote]

awright...that's hitting below the belt!

:-)

4 turtles total over last year left
3 to 91
one to HS ball only

One 91 from turtles committed, other two going to two different IVY schools AFAIK with commits pending whatever...blah blah blah

two kids left both csh kids. one to virginia and one to ivy. done. both good kids. was there a third?

not in the turtle loop r ya?

No 2017 is committed to an Ivy. Try again.

Why are goalies less likely to early commit? The 2016 class still have relatively fewer commits, and there are no 2017 commits.

While I believe the Turtles are a great Team, I think they try to recruit as a Team. Therefore I don't think many of them go out by themselves. I might be wrong, but they follow the Coach. Time will tell if they made the correct move. A couple more LI Verbals from lesser Teams and the panic alarms will go off.

Turtle to Hpkins

I thought they were all going Ivy

You just aren't in the "know"....if only you were.

Well, wait until Feb 1st...then you can eat your unkowkedgable words.

Ignorance. It's a crime.

Get over yourself a little and read on please. Our son was given the nod he has a bespoke spot on two Ivy rosters if he meets certain AI criteria to be eligible for a "commit to the admissions process" spot. It is one year of grades. We were told that the athletic directors in the league insist on the calculus being the same, and being shared by the ADs in the league. A checks and balances.

Ivy league ADs have colluded to say if a kid does not meet an AI range, you can't recruit him at all. Then their are tiers to the AI ranges and coaches in each sport are only given per diem for kids at the bottom of the ranges. Some programs won't even bother with your kid if he is less than a 200 or a 190...there are enough good lacrosse or other sport players out there with AI scores in the higher ranges so that the coaches don't need to go to the 180s or lower ranges if allowed to bring in a lacrosse or ice hockey ringer.

So here is the punchline: your very special 2017 player and my very special 2017 player will not be committing to an Ivy on Feb 1st unless you go wildcatting and announcing something stupid and misleading on your own. Because 9th graders don't have an AI score. The earliest point you can get one is after you kid gets a PSAT or equivalent standardized test score from the Fall of 2014 when he is a sophomore.

So, LI Dad, hurry up and get your son seated for the September 13, 2014 testing date which is the first one in the next academic year. I looked that up for you. You will get the scores back in 7-10 business days. I looked that up for you too, and you're welcome. And if all goes along perfect you can run to your mailbox each day this coming September and somewhere in late September you can really stick it to us and announce to the world that your son is committed to UPenn. We know that from the lunacy of your prior posts. From there, I wish that program and their coaches the best in dealing with you and your family for four years.

If you have no ideal about what an AI is, what it means, what the timeframes are for the data inputs to have one are, then there is someone very misinformed and it is not me. And learn to spell. It is "fail to acknowledge"....not "unkowkedgable" for your future blogging reference.

Frankly, if your panties are in a bunch over getting your kid committed, dial up SUNIJ, nee Rutgers, my bountifully waisted Philly bro. It does not seem like he has an Ivy league bloodline anyways.

Among the 2016s verbal commits totals for Ivy:
Brown 3, Cornell 7, UPenn 2 and Princeton 1.

Hardly and arms race for the year ahead of these 2017 kids and their families.

can someone please explain the selection process for 3d in florida and what to expect down there? just heard that there are limited spots to JR.

Very slick writing. How many iterations and versions did you have to go through to write that one??? Ever here of the Ivy Golden ticket? Most likely not. Every Ivy coach has 2-3 golden tickets he can use for outstanding players with average to above average grades and SAT's. Check it out, you'd be surprised. Kind of works along the same lines as members of certain "underrepresented groups". Ahh the Ivies... Why would you want your son to go to one of those Leftist, Stalinist infested cesspools anyway?

here is the lowdown on 3d. it is an excellent opportunity for you to measure your son against good competition. the camp is both instructional and well worth just the experience. your son is placed on an individual team who then practices and plays together throughout the camp. each team plays each other just like JR. evaluators are looking for the best team players not the ball hogs. found it to be fair and equal opportunity. good luck.

I don't know about fair and equal opportunity, lets not get carried away. There were two directors of premier Long Island travel programs down there last year coaching teams and lobbying for their own kids to get invites. Having said that, if your son stands out he has a 50/50 shot at getting an invite to the Jake Reed summer camp.

Outstanding rhetoric. Wait....here it comes......there!! "...."; the exact moment I stopped giving a c$@p about anything you went through the trouble to explain.

It's not Penn, btw; and please excuse the typo. Clearly none of us are as anal as you to research all of the possible needs to get into an IVY....then again...perhaps your child is not as special as you represent him to be, or you'd have been told how the AI can be and has been, let's say, modified for academically and athletically gifted players.

You, my self delusional and uptight friend, were let down easy so as to not hurt your feelings. You see; it's not easy for them to tell you any other way. Thus, the exquisitly long and painful diatribe on your part to inform us all of how hard it will be for YOUR kid to get in somewhere.

Fortunately, that's not always the case. For the right players, that is.

Now go take a Prozac and relax.

The below is from Tier1athletics.org - I have no idea the accuracy but from friend of mine with kids going through this it sounds pretty accurate, This is also interesting because it is not about lacrosse but about Ivy League recruiting,

"Interpreting the Academic Index Number for Ivy League Athletes"


We’re treading on dangerous ground here so I suppose I should start this with a big disclaimer. The number that you have calculated using the Academic Index calculator should only serve as a general guideline to help you plan your recruiting. Hitting certain numbers does not mean that you are assured of admission since many different factors go into determining admissibility.

The Academic Index is really a tool to evaluate large groups (teams, overall athletic cohort and entire student body.) That said, I think it’s helpful to be able to see where you stand in relation to other students and athletes.

Below are my interpretations of the strength of different AI ranges. These are based on interviews, articles and statements, but you should not consider them to be any sort of official guideline or standard.

Under 176
An Academic Index under 176 is below the minimum generally required to be recruited in the Ivy League.

177-190
I would classify AIs in this range as “possible”, but weak. Nationally known, big-time recruits in high profile sports may be okay with an AI in this range.

191-200
We’re getting closer to the comfort range. This is still on the weaker side, but scores in this range may be adequate for highly desirable athletes in certain programs.

201-210
This equates to about 1850 -1900 combined SAT and 3.5 unweighted GPA and should put a recruit on fairly solid academic footing. Teams that tend to attract kids with stronger academics may want a little bit more.

Over 210
This is really where you want to be. With an AI over 210, I think it’s pretty unlikely that academics will be a deal killer in your athletic recruiting.

I would agree with this assessment. At our session it was unseasonably cold and the two evaluators were huddled up in a golf cart and were not very attentive. Like anything where there is a lot of good players there is going to be some luck and variability as to who gets selected.

Does anyone know how the AI is calculated? Looks like a combination of GPA and test scores but not sure about the calculation. Is there an AI calculation for ACT test takers?

[/quote]

Does anyone know how the AI is calculated? Looks like a combination of GPA and test scores but not sure about the calculation. Is there an AI calculation for ACT test takers? [/quote]

Hi. I am the Dad who made the first reference to AI on this thread. The AI is not a number that is known to you. It is a proprietary formula that takes into account GPA, some premium for AP or Honors courses, standardized test scores and some other factors that are not disclosed or quantified for us the consumers. If you Google search, you will find a number of AI calculators. However, please also Google the NY Times articles on this topic and they are quite good to explain that the AI recipe is not given out and that most of the tools to calculate it on the internet are inaccurate.

My understanding from college coaches who are interested in the candidacy of my 2017 son is that the soonest there are viable inputs for there to be an AI output is in the sophomore year. What is given and is known is standardized test scores have an input weight and that the minimal set of grades is one full year of transcripts to calculate weighted and unweighted GPAs. Of course the college coaches recruiting your son will be quite interested in his progress, including grades he has made in school already in 9th grade, but for this year keep the terminology correct. It is progress toward and AI that is needed to be able to qualify your son to be recruited AT ALL. The NY TImes articles echo what we were told...there can be a marginal candidate who passes through, but that marginal candidates in this definition set are still good students with good grades and scores (a 3.3 kid with 1100 SATs like a zillion others? that is my crude guess). Also, once your son has an AI, the coach recruiting him has no obligation and likely will not tell you what the specific score is. But he will tell you "yes, I can recruit your son because he meets our non-lacrosse requirements."

If you believe your son is the ringer of the class and the coach will "get him in no matter", then I just don't know. I rather doubt it if we are talking about a B/C student with 50th percentile standardized scores going to Princeton or Yale. For the rest of us I think the correct information is to be aware that grades, standardized test scores and AP courses are very desired and to focus on having those in good order to be a student athlete candidate at an Ivy.

The pot I seem to have stirred was to call out that Ivies won't be taking any verbal commits from the 2017s this academic year. The best you can do now is establish with the coaches if your son is a lacrosse candidate, and come back next year with the academic goods to ensure that spot is your son's with the academic side also showing strong credentials. Going on believing your son is a lights out lacrosse player and none of this matters is not a viable path.

http://www.tier1athletics.org/2012/10/01/academic-index-calculator-2012/

if you click on the link
Academic Index Calculator 2012

it will open a spread sheet with the formulas

"Does anyone know how the AI is calculated? Looks like a combination of GPA and test scores but not sure about the calculation. Is there an AI calculation for ACT test takers?"

The AI is a proprietary formula. There are calculators on the web to calculate one, but the sources have said each of them are flawed. The NY Times has done some articles on the AI and have quoted AD's and coaches at Ivy league schools in them. There are hard inputs including GPA unweighted, some measure for AP or other advanced courses and standardized test scores such as PSAT, SAT or ACT. Interestingly the AI scores for all admitted student athletes in the league are shared between the institutions in what seems to be an open checks and balances.

Basically, to be recruited as a student athlete you must meet certain criteria and the bar is set high. I would find it very difficult to believe that this process is negotiable for an average B/C student with 1100 SATs to except someone for being a special lacrosse talent. The league seems to have laid down the law that there are enough strong students who are also strong athletic talents both so that there are no meathead hall passes.

Because standardized test scores and GPAs are needed as inputs, I would find it hard to believe Ivy league coaches are able to make offers out to 2017s until next year.

AI is based on 3 criteria which are worth 80pt each for a highest total of 240
Part 1
(( SAT writing+ SAT CR)/2 + SAT MATH/20 = AI
Part 2
Take 2 best scores from history bio and math and add them up and divide by 20
Part 3
Weighted GPA. 4.3 = 80 points 4.0 =77....

Then refer to above scales.

My freshman is 19 years old and we love all the whining on this board.

I have a 19 year old freshman. Deal with it!

So he was like 8 in kindergarten ?

Hey, I have an 18 year old HS freshman. But I'm only 35 and am expectant grandpa, so I win. Or maybe not.